UK's Moscow medal hopes • [Eriksson's out, who's in?]

[bushop]

London 2012 Olympics: Why van Commenee must stay
August 12, 2012
"If he now resigns – as he always threatened to do if the GB team “failed” hit the eight medals target - it would be a travesty. Not to mention a major error for the sport as it heads towards Glasgow 2014, Rio 2016 and London 2017."

[Tuariki]

London 2012 Olympics: Why van Commenee must stay
August 12, 2012
"If he now resigns – as he always threatened to do if the GB team “failed” hit the eight medals target - it would be a travesty. Not to mention a major error for the sport as it heads towards Glasgow 2014, Rio 2016 and London 2017."

For Glasgow 2014 who does van Commenee represent given that there is no Great Britain team. England, Wales,Scotland and Northern Ireland all compete as individual countries?

[bushop]

For Glasgow 2014 who does van Commenee represent given that there is no Great Britain team. England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland all compete as individual countries?

Commonwealth Games 2010: Charles van Commenee backs Phillips Idowu
23 Sep 2010
With England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland competing separately in Delhi rather than in a Great Britain team, van Commenee has no formal role in India.
But although he has faith in the people in charge of the various teams, he admitted he would not 'turn his back' on any athletes who sought his help."

UK Athletics head coach urges top athletes to compete at Glasgow 2014 Commonwealth Games
14 February 2012
[van Commenee] told The Herald Newspaper in Scotland.
"The Commonwealth Games is a serious event. I think it's in everybody's diary for 2014."

[bman]

It will be interesting to see if big names compete this time around given the more traditional end of july time table.

[Tuariki]

It will be interesting to see if big names compete this time around given the more traditional end of july time table.

They will if they consider it doesn't hurt their chances at making dollars on the professional circuit. Winning a Commonwealth Games gold does nothing for your market value.

[rsb2]

It would be nice to see the Commonwealth Games return to their former status, and I think it can happen with some co-operative scheduling. After all, the Commonwealth plays to almost 2 billion people, in 55 countries, and when the big guns show up, it's a hell of a track meet, much stronger than the Europeans in most events on the track.

[jackbean]

It's a pet peeve of mine when the relay medals are put on the same pedestal as individual medals, and when stated are goals are to get X medals. A relay medal isn't - and will never be - equal to an ind. medal. Surely it is worth somewhere between 1/3 (1 entrance per nation vs. 3 athletes per nation) and 200/7,000,000,000 (rough estimate of number of nations vs. world population) of an individual medal ??? Get along with the plan and state your bloody goals as number of individual medals. On topic, the UK would do extremely well to walk away with 5 individual medal.
ETA - or is it GBR? Another pet-peeve of mine

So should team medals in cycling not count, maybe the 8 in rowing is only worth 12.5% or individual rowers. Maybe no team sports should be played at all

Of for goodness sake, way to miss the point completely. We're talking about athletics here, in these posts, on the athletics forum. No one's saying get rid of hockey or water polo.

[mump boy]

It will be interesting to see if big names compete this time around given the more traditional end of july time table.

They will if they consider it doesn't hurt their chances at making dollars on the professional circuit. Winning a Commonwealth Games gold does nothing for your market value.

It certainly does in UK meets

Louise Hazel won the CWG Hep in Delhi and saw her profile rise massively, to the point that she is one of the most recognisable members of our team with TV appearances, photos shoots and the face of Panosonic Olympic tv campaign.

Of course it helps that she's gorgeous with a great personality and competes in the same event as Jess but without that won there would be nothing to promote her with, CWG made her career.

http://www.youtube.com/user/panasonic20 ... sults_main

[mump boy]

It's a pet peeve of mine when the relay medals are put on the same pedestal as individual medals, and when stated are goals are to get X medals. A relay medal isn't - and will never be - equal to an ind. medal. Surely it is worth somewhere between 1/3 (1 entrance per nation vs. 3 athletes per nation) and 200/7,000,000,000 (rough estimate of number of nations vs. world population) of an individual medal ??? Get along with the plan and state your bloody goals as number of individual medals. On topic, the UK would do extremely well to walk away with 5 individual medal.
ETA - or is it GBR? Another pet-peeve of mine

So should team medals in cycling not count, maybe the 8 in rowing is only worth 12.5% or individual rowers. Maybe no team sports should be played at all

Of for goodness sake, way to miss the point completely. We're talking about athletics here, in these posts, on the athletics forum. No one's saying get rid of hockey or water polo.

So team medals count in every other sport just not track ??

Explain to me the difference between the 4x4 and the team pursuit ? and why one should be celebrated and the other denigrated

[bushop]

Charles van Commenee leaves British athletics in rude health after golden London Olympics for Team GB
10 Sep 2012
"Having pledged to quit if he failed to hit his medal target, Van Commenee has remained true to his principles by departing at the end of his contract, though it is understood he was ready to leave anyway because he did not have the appetite for another five years in charge."

[gh]

"his" medal target? Let's see, Farah works in the U.S. with Salazar, Rutherford is talking about following Pfaff back across the Atlantic. Exactly what does VC get credit for? (not to pick on the guy, but the concept of "national coach" seems to me to be totally ludicrous in the professional era)

[Daisy]

the concept of "national coach" seems to me to be totally ludicrous in the professional era)

Someone has to bring them down to size.

[j-a-m]

"his" medal target? Let's see, Farah works in the U.S. with Salazar, Rutherford is talking about following Pfaff back across the Atlantic. Exactly what does VC get credit for?

For not interfering with Salazar and Pfaff?

[mal]

Charles van Commenee leaves British athletics in rude health after golden London Olympics for Team GB
10 Sep 2012
"Having pledged to quit if he failed to hit his medal target, Van Commenee has remained true to his principles by departing at the end of his contract, though it is understood he was ready to leave anyway because he did not have the appetite for another five years in charge."

I understand how he feels. I did 26 months in my position in the UK and didn't extend cos I had no appetite for another year.

Its a strange place, even with all those bright people.

[bushop]

...but the concept of "national coach" seems to me to be totally ludicrous in the professional era)

Selection and funding, and therefor motivation, of the athletes.

[bushop]

UK Athletics to replace head coach Charles van Commenee with internal candidate
11 Sep 2012
"De Vos confirmed that he had been aware that van Commenee might not remain beyond his contract and that plans had been put in motion some time ago."

Tyler poised for UKA role
September 12 2012
"Kevin Tyler, who has been UK Athletics' strategic head of coaching and development since 2008, has built a reputation as a "coach of coaches" and worked closely with van Commenee."

[bushop]

Van Commenee's departure leaves a large and Special gap
12 September 2012
"The Dutchman's reasoning over the issue is unimpeachable. "If I hold athletes and coaches accountable every day, how could I work over the next four years if I am not held accountable myself?" van Commenee had asked – rhetorically – when he spoke to the media at the end of the London 2012 Olympics."

[bushop]

Black appointed British performance director
Sep 13, 2012
"Neil Black was appointed performance director of UK Athletics (UKA) on Thursday and among his first tasks will be finding a replacement for Charles van Commenee as Olympic head coach."

[shivfan]

Hmmm...so if CVC was already planning to leave, it seems he was trying to set a target that he was convinced GB would not achieve.

I'm not mourning his departure for a couple of reasons:

1) Insisting that athletes compete in the unimportant European Cup, or whatever that rubbish meet was called, instead of allowing them to prepare for the bigger prizes.

2) That distasteful, unnecessary and immature spat with Idowu.

[mump boy]

Hmmm...so if CVC was already planning to leave, it seems he was trying to set a target that he was convinced GB would not achieve.

I'm not mourning his departure for a couple of reasons:

1) Insisting that athletes compete in the unimportant European Cup, or whatever that rubbish meet was called, instead of allowing them to prepare for the bigger prizes.

2) That distasteful, unnecessary and immature spat with Idowu.

I'll give you the PI spat but athletes on funding should compete at euro cup or whatever it's called these days. Anyone who's season would be jeopardised by being asked to compete for their country once needs to look at their preparation !!

UK athletes would do well to compete more not less

[shivfan]

The problem with that European Cup is that if it fits into your training regime, and your plan to peak at the major Games, then fine, but if it doesn't, you shouldn't be railroaded into competing...that's what I think CVC did wrong.

I just can't see the JAAA telling Bolt that he has to run at the CAC Games....

[mump boy]

The problem with that European Cup is that if it fits into your training regime, and your plan to peak at the major Games, then fine, but if it doesn't, you shouldn't be railroaded into competing...that's what I think CVC did wrong.

I just can't see the JAAA telling Bolt that he has to run at the CAC Games....

Well you should make it fit into your training regime. The best of our athletes should be able to compete at the EC without messing with their peak for major games, it's not as if they are being asked to peak twice, just compete once at the end of June, they can treat it as training if they want. UK athletes spend too much time training (not always effectively) and not enough time competing.

If our best don't turn out for EC there is no point us competing, we don't have the depth in most events to enter a B team and still be successful. Why should those that are funded be able to opt out of competing for their country so we have to rely on those without funding ? What sense does that make ?

[Anthony Treacher]

Charles van Commenee leaves British athletics in rude health after golden London Olympics for Team GB
10 Sep 2012
"Having pledged to quit if he failed to hit his medal target, Van Commenee has remained true to his principles by departing at the end of his contract, though it is understood he was ready to leave anyway because he did not have the appetite for another five years in charge."

I understand how he feels. I did 26 months in my position in the UK and didn't extend cos I had no appetite for another year.

Its a strange place, even with all those bright people.

And 'all those bright people' were in UK athletics?

[lionelp1]

Hmmm...so if CVC was already planning to leave, it seems he was trying to set a target that he was convinced GB would not achieve.

I'm not mourning his departure for a couple of reasons:

1) Insisting that athletes compete in the unimportant European Cup, or whatever that rubbish meet was called, instead of allowing them to prepare for the bigger prizes.

2) That distasteful, unnecessary and immature spat with Idowu.

I'll give you the PI spat but athletes on funding should compete at euro cup or whatever it's called these days. Anyone who's season would be jeopardised by being asked to compete for their country once needs to look at their preparation !!

UK athletes would do well to compete more not less

"Anyone who's season" should read "anyone whose season"

Surely no one is mourning the departure of CVC who achieved nothing much apart from alienating a few athletes and burnishing his reputation for being Mr Hardman.

As has been pointed out CVC has not done anything special in the way of the elite and medal achievements, but was happy to agree spending a lot of money, by Brit coach standards, on a few foreign coaches, loads of funding to athletes, a lot of which was a total waste, the happy importation of a few imported "British" athletes which did not really work in London.

Under CVC's watch our sprint relay teams are currently a rather sad joke and our 4x400 are no cause for huzzahs. What did CVC achieve in the individual sprints, middle distances and frankly in the long distances , except for Farah, who really owes much to Salazar for the final 5 per cent.

A great elderly coach for our hurdler of the future is nowt much to do with CVC. I suppose one can praise him a little but heck the guy was taking home a nice pay cheque.

[eldanielfire]

Hmmm...so if CVC was already planning to leave, it seems he was trying to set a target that he was convinced GB would not achieve.

I'm not mourning his departure for a couple of reasons:

1) Insisting that athletes compete in the unimportant European Cup, or whatever that rubbish meet was called, instead of allowing them to prepare for the bigger prizes.

2) That distasteful, unnecessary and immature spat with Idowu.

I'll give you the PI spat but athletes on funding should compete at euro cup or whatever it's called these days. Anyone who's season would be jeopardised by being asked to compete for their country once needs to look at their preparation !!

UK athletes would do well to compete more not less

"Anyone who's season" should read "anyone whose season"

Surely no one is mourning the departure of CVC who achieved nothing much apart from alienating a few athletes and burnishing his reputation for being Mr Hardman.

As has been pointed out CVC has not done anything special in the way of the elite and medal achievements, but was happy to agree spending a lot of money, by Brit coach standards, on a few foreign coaches, loads of funding to athletes, a lot of which was a total waste, the happy importation of a few imported "British" athletes which did not really work in London.

Under CVC's watch our sprint relay teams are currently a rather sad joke and our 4x400 are no cause for huzzahs. What did CVC achieve in the individual sprints, middle distances and frankly in the long distances , except for Farah, who really owes much to Salazar for the final 5 per cent.

A great elderly coach for our hurdler of the future is nowt much to do with CVC. I suppose one can praise him a little but heck the guy was taking home a nice pay cheque.

Tatunfair to CVC. Almobody who has orkedr him ascredite him with changing the culture in UK athletics and turning it from one that looked for excuses to one that works for success. It doesn't all payoff at Elite level in a few years. However British athletes produced 11 personal bests in London, seven season's bests, two national records and one UK under-20 record. Quite a proud record compared to say swimming, under target and a bunch of losers trying to alternatively claim not getting a PB is somehow a good thing before saying the pressure was too much. CVC did a good job however that doesnt mean it's not the right time to move on.

[telf]

by eldanielfire » Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:19 pm
...changing the culture in UK athletics and turning it from one that looked for excuses to one that works for success. It doesn't all payoff at Elite level in a few years. However British athletes produced 11 personal bests in London, seven season's bests, two national records and one UK under-20 record.

100% correct.

There has, to my eyes, been a grass roots cultural shift from that of mediocrity and a sense of funding entitlement to one of personal responsibility, accountability, working hard and winning to succeed.

Unsurprisingly there are quite a number of disaffected athletes in the UK who think that youth and junior titles or one good PB should entitle them to a decade of funding irrespective of their failure to progress.

That type of thinking is a charter for failure and part of the reason why many of the past and present elite have had to circumvent the system in order to succeed.

[tandfman]

I know this point has been mentioned in the general press; I'm not sure it's been made here, and I don't have time to scroll through this long thread to find out, so at the risk of being repetitive . . . .

It seems to me that CVC put himself in the postiion where he HAD to resign. He made a big issue of accountability, and then said publicly that if they didn't get 8 medals, he'd resign. After that, how could he not resign without undermining his credibility when it comes to the importance of accountability?

Whether he set that goal and made that statement in order to give him the excuse to do something he wanted to do anyway for personal reasons, I can't say. But I do think he deliberately set a high standard for himself and his team, and was always willing to live with the consequences of failing to meet that standard.

From afar, I did admire most of what he did during his tenure.

[mump boy]

Also if he wanted to continue he would have to commit to at least after WC 2017 in London. I don't think he's want to be in the thankless job for another 5 years. Especially if he has other countries (Brazil ?) calling

[mal]

Charles van Commenee leaves British athletics in rude health after golden London Olympics for Team GB
10 Sep 2012
"Having pledged to quit if he failed to hit his medal target, Van Commenee has remained true to his principles by departing at the end of his contract, though it is understood he was ready to leave anyway because he did not have the appetite for another five years in charge."

I understand how he feels. I did 26 months in my position in the UK and didn't extend cos I had no appetite for another year.

Its a strange place, even with all those bright people.

And 'all those bright people' were in UK athletics?

Cultural thing. The UK is full of bright people.

Seriously. Smart as heck. Not a lot of results though.

[bushop]

Kevin Tyler to leave UKA
"UKA announced today that the Strategic Head of Coaching and Development, Kevin Tyler, has decided to... return to Canada..."

[Speedster]

Not sure if I have missed this on here, but Rana Reider (Tianna Madison, Christian Taylor, Shara Proctor) is coming to the UK to work as a consultant, article says he's already working with Harry AA.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gene ... 12529.html

[bushop]

Peter Eriksson named new head coach of UK Athletics
October 29, 2012
“The Olympic team performed very well, so I have a great platform on which to build. But I believe that we can still do better in Rio, and of course when the World Championships take place in London in 2017. The next five years look like an exhilarating time for British athletics.”

Five problems for the new head coach of UK Athletics
Monday 29 October 2012
1.) The 4x100m relay teams
2.) Phillips Idowu
3.) The Olympic hangover
4.) The men's 100m
5.) The 'golden generation'

UK chief to woo Idowu
29th October 2012
Yesterday in a final swipe at van Commenee, Idowu tweeted: “Happy for Peter Eriksson. Met him in Italy a few years ago and he was actually coaching (not just a title).”

Peter Eriksson takes reins of UK Athletics and pledges softer approach
29 OCTOBER 2012
"If you compare me with Charles, we have the same outcome in mind. We want to perform better. We want to have more medals. That would be the same side of things. Not the same side would be: I have a Twitter account and he doesn't. I don't write on it all the time, but I read it because I think it's interesting."

[eldanielfire]

That will be an interesting call, will he have as much success with able bodied athletes as the less competitive paraolympians he's had such success with.

Of course the current coaches at least have a crop of athletes with potential and after CVC by many accounts the work ethic has improved and the excuse culture has lessened. It's nice that UK athletics seem to be promoting the people who under the CVC era seemed to have made the successes and have the plan for afterwards.

[Flumpy]

2.) Phillips Idowu

Olympic Games
Silver 2008 Beijing

World Championships
Gold 2009 Berlin
Silver 2011 Daegu

European Championships
Gold 2010 Barcelona

Commonwealth Games
Gold 2006 Melbourne
Silver 2002 Manchester

World Indoor Championships
Gold 2008 Valencia

European Indoor Championships
Gold 2007 Birmingham

If only we had more 'problems' like Phillips.

[26mi235]

Isn't the problem resolving the problems that keep there from being a London 2012 entry prominent on that list?