Is Iran at the precipice of a revolution?


Normally open July 4th only---the one day a year when partisan politics, religion, etc. are acceptable topics on this Board (within reason). The forum is now closed.

Is Iran at the precipice of a revolution?

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:33 am

It's not looking good for the Mullahs.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/06/ ... index.html
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby gh » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:58 am

things are just fine for the mullahs.... protests are against the ruling party, not them (unfortunately).
gh
 
Posts: 46290
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:58 am

We are fighting with our lives and the world is just watching," said Ali, a Tehran University student who did not want his full name used for safety reasons. "They see how the government is trying to silence us, how they are beating us -- but they don't come to our help. It's OK. We will succeed, even if we have to fight alone."

How can we possibly help these people? It could get real ugly.
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby richxx87 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:04 am

Whether it's I'maDinnerJacket or the other dude, doesn't really matter. It's a dysfunctional kleptocracy that shields itself from criticism by basing the system on a pre-Medieval book composed by charlatans.

I really don't want to be harsh or sound like some anti-PC redneck, because I actually live in a nominally Muslim country and understand what the average Muslim is dealing with, but when a government puts ALL its eggs in that twisted basket like Iran has, there really is no happy ending.
richxx87
 
Posts: 1833
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Bali

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:17 am

SQUACKEE wrote:We are fighting with our lives and the world is just watching," said Ali, a Tehran University student who did not want his full name used for safety reasons. "They see how the government is trying to silence us, how they are beating us -- but they don't come to our help. It's OK. We will succeed, even if we have to fight alone."

How can we possibly help these people? It could get real ugly.

The worst thing that can happen to the protesters is that the U.S. gets involved or that Obama makes some billigerent or bellicose statement. Then the Mullahs and Ahmadinejad would say this is 1953 all over again and Moussavi is another Shah. Pat Buchanan wrote a great column on this yesterday.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:35 am

Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:37 am

dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


yep, exactly the same. :roll:
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:39 am

SQUACKEE wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


yep, exactly the same. :roll:
SQUACKEE YOU A DEM???????
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:02 am

dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.

Hezbollah is in Lebanon, not Palestine and I don't think Hassan Nasrallah would have been so gracious in defeat if he thought that the election was rigged.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:08 am

jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.

Hezbollah is in Lebanon, not Palestine and I don't think Hassan Nasrallah would have been so gracious in defeat if he thought that the election was rigged.
Yes your right Jazz thanks forgot about you telling me earlier.Again I still say they should ask for a recount don't trust the jews for a split second.
Last edited by dal4018 on Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby gm » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:09 am

dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


utter crap, Dwight
gm
 
Posts: 4555
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: "What's the pre-cooked weight on that lab?"

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:11 am

gm wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


utter crap, Dwight
So you believe Bush won fare and square???????
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:12 am

dal4018 wrote:
SQUACKEE wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


yep, exactly the same. :roll:
SQUACKEE YOU A DEM???????

I have to agree with SQUACKEE on this one. In Florida, what happened is that the US. Supreme Court, in a straight party line vote, denied the American citizens an honest and accurate vote count similar to what's going on with the Minnesota Senate race. I look at vote counting the way I look at instant replay in football. The most important thing is to get the right decision, not a fast decision. I don't think anyone ever accused Bush or anyone else of conspiring beforehand to dilberately miscount the votes in Florida, which is what Ahmadinejad is being accused of.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:15 am

dal4018 wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.

Hezbollah is in Lebanon, not Palestine and I don't think Hassan Nasrallah would have been so gracious in defeat if he thought that the election was rigged.
Yes your right Jazz thanks forgot about you telling me earlier.Again I still say they should ask for a recount don't trust the jews for a split second.

Come on man! Jews had nothing to do with elections in Lebanon, and neither did Zionists. You're really exposing yourself now. Are you trying to get Garry to ban you?
Last edited by jazzcyclist on Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:15 am

Jazz its amazing Arab insiders say they are more concerned with Iran's nuclear ambitions than Israel have they forgotten "Zionville" is the enemy!!!!!! This was said on I believe either Hardball or Countdown.
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby dakota » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:16 am

deleted
Last edited by dakota on Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:40 am, edited 4 times in total.
dakota
 
Posts: 1413
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:17 am

dal4018 wrote:Jazz its amazing Arab insiders say they are more concerned with Iran's nuclear ambitions than Israel have they forgotten "Zionville" is the enemy!!!!!! This was said on I believe either Hardball or Countdown.

Arab governments are more concerned with Iran, but the Arab street is more concerned with the Palestinians.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:21 am

jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.

Hezbollah is in Lebanon, not Palestine and I don't think Hassan Nasrallah would have been so gracious in defeat if he thought that the election was rigged.
Yes your right Jazz thanks forgot about you telling me earlier.Again I still say they should ask for a recount don't trust the jews for a split second.

Come on man! Jews had nothing to do with elections in Lebanon, and neither did Zionists. You're really exposing yourself now. Are you trying to get Garry to ban you?
No sir I'am not.
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby dal4018 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:22 am

jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Jazz its amazing Arab insiders say they are more concerned with Iran's nuclear ambitions than Israel have they forgotten "Zionville" is the enemy!!!!!! This was said on I believe either Hardball or Countdown.

Arab governments are more concerned with Iran, but the Arab street is more concerned with the Palestinians.
You know who I side with the ppl in the streets.
dal4018
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:32 am

Postby skiboo » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:24 am

Has anyone asked Sarah Palin what she thinks about what's going on in Iran?

:P
skiboo
 
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:00 am
Location: somewhere cold

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:26 am

dal4018 wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:Come on man! Jews had nothing to do with elections in Lebanon, and neither did Zionists. You're really exposing yourself now. Are you trying to get Garry to ban you?
No sir I'am not.

A good rule of thumb is to never use the word "the" in front of the name of a racial, religious or ethnic group if you are also going to use a perjorative phrase or adjective such as "don't trust" along with it.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:27 am

Dead man posting.
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby dakota » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:29 am

jazzcyclist wrote: I don't think anyone ever accused Bush or anyone else of conspiring beforehand to dilberately miscount the votes in Florida,


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... rida,_2000
dakota
 
Posts: 1413
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:45 am

dakota wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote: I don't think anyone ever accused Bush or anyone else of conspiring beforehand to dilberately miscount the votes in Florida,


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... rida,_2000

I had never heard about this:
Also noted was a purge of some 50,000 alleged felons from the Florida voting rolls, which were nearly half African-American voters. The majority of these were not felons and should have been eligible to vote under Florida law.

I wonder if the Bush campaign had any knowledge or involvement with this. The other stuff just seems like run-of-the-mill dirty tricks that both parties engage in.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby rasb » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:03 am

skiboo wrote:Has anyone asked Sarah Palin what she thinks about what's going on in Iran?

:P


Yes, and apparently Sarah said, "I don't know - I can't see it from my porch".

Thanks for the very interesting post, dakota.

Bye, dal .
rasb
 
Posts: 2008
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 4:48 pm
Location: South of the 49th

Postby lonewolf » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:08 am

Iranian students had a comparable uprising in 1999, which is still celebrated by the expatriate community, but were brutally put down and hundreds/thousands are still political prisoners.
My sources, direct from the streets in Iran, say that an overwhelming majority of Iranians, of all ages, would like to oust the mullahs and live in an open, free society in harmony with the rest of the world.
Unfortunately, it is the hardline, medevialists who have the guns. Of course, that did not deter the overthrow of the Shah, so... stay tuned..
lonewolf
 
Posts: 8811
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Indian Territory

Postby lonewolf » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:20 am

dal4018 wrote:
gm wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.


utter crap, Dwight
So you believe Bush won fare and square???????


My God, are there still people out there parroting this tired old discredited mantra? I deliberately avoid political threads and wish the mods would enforce their guidelines but, someimes, ya gotta speak up.

The 2000 elections were interminably conducted under intense scrutiny in accordance with election laws. Bush won. Thank God that Gore did not win. Get over it.
lonewolf
 
Posts: 8811
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Indian Territory

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:43 am

lonewolf wrote:Thank God that Gore did not win.

I'd rather curse God for that one. :P
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:47 am

lonewolf wrote:Iranian students had a comparable uprising in 1999, which is still celebrated by the expatriate community, but were brutally put down and hundreds/thousands are still political prisoners.
My sources, direct from the streets in Iran, say that an overwhelming majority of Iranians, of all ages, would like to oust the mullahs and live in an open, free society in harmony with the rest of the world.
Unfortunately, it is the hardline, medevialists who have the guns. Of course, that did not deter the overthrow of the Shah, so... stay tuned..

Iranians may want a free society, but even the most liberal pro-Western Iranians support the continuation of Iran's nuclear program.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:58 am

jazzcyclist wrote: but even the most liberal pro-Western Iranians support the continuation of Iran's nuclear program.


Because they think its only for energy or they know its for bombs and want nucs?
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:31 am

SQUACKEE wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote: but even the most liberal pro-Western Iranians support the continuation of Iran's nuclear program.


Because they think its only for energy or they know its for bombs and want nucs?

Probably both, but I think it's more of prestige and nationalism thing. Why should some countries in the region be allowed to have nukes, including their mortal enemy, and not others? Mohamed Elbaradei, Director General of the International Atomic Energy Agency put it this way:
In areas of longstanding conflict like the Middle East, South Asia and the Korean Peninsula, the pursuit of weapons of mass destruction can be expected as long as we fail to introduce alternatives that redress the security deficit. We must abandon the unworkable notion that it is morally reprehensible for some countries to pursue weapons of mass destruction yet morally acceptable for others to rely on them for security and indeed to continue to refine their capacities and postulate plans for their use.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby rasb » Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:31 am

Apparently, Mousavi has called for a giant street demonstration for tomorrow
in Tehran and he is planning to be there. The demonstrations look plenty big enough today, and there are lots of reports of gunfire.
Whether that is allowed to take place tomorrow, or not, and the amount of violence involved, should give us insight into future possibilities.
The Iranian Men's Soccer/Football team all wore green armbands (in support of Mousavi) during the first half of their game in South Korea today,
but not during the second half.
rasb
 
Posts: 2008
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 4:48 pm
Location: South of the 49th

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:42 am

jazzcyclist wrote:
SQUACKEE wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote: but even the most liberal pro-Western Iranians support the continuation of Iran's nuclear program.


Because they think its only for energy or they know its for bombs and want nucs?

Probably both, but I think it's more of prestige and nationalism thing. Why should some countries in the region be allowed to have nukes, including their mortal enemy, and not others? Mohamed Elbaradei, Director General of the International Atomic Energy Agency put it this way:
In areas of longstanding conflict like the Middle East, South Asia and the Korean Peninsula, the pursuit of weapons of mass destruction can be expected as long as we fail to introduce alternatives that redress the security deficit. We must abandon the unworkable notion that it is morally reprehensible for some countries to pursue weapons of mass destruction yet morally acceptable for others to rely on them for security and indeed to continue to refine their capacities and postulate plans for their use.


I understand the lodgic behind this but only a madman wants more countries in the middle east with nucs.
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby Pego » Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:54 am

dal4018 wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:
dal4018 wrote:Everyone is talking about the sham electoral process in Iran but no one has mentioned the equally sham elections that took place in Palestine that robbed Hezbollah it was just like the sham Presidential elections that took place in this country in '00 that robbed Gore of the Presidency in Florida.

Hezbollah is in Lebanon, not Palestine and I don't think Hassan Nasrallah would have been so gracious in defeat if he thought that the election was rigged.
Yes your right Jazz thanks forgot about you telling me earlier.Again I still say they should ask for a recount don't trust the jews for a split second.


So far, all geopolitical comments you have made were uninformed nonsense. Now it's bigoted nonsense.
Pego
 
Posts: 10196
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: beyond help

Postby skiboo » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:21 am

SQUACKEE wrote:Dead man posting.


That ought to be the case. Look what happened to Mennisco when he went on his anti-Kraut rant. :lol:
skiboo
 
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:00 am
Location: somewhere cold

Postby skiboo » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:22 am

skiboo
 
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:00 am
Location: somewhere cold

Postby jazzcyclist » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:26 am

The Iranian regime is desperate to redirect the hostility and unrest to the West and try and paint the protesters as American puppets, or even worse Zionist puppets. Nothing would give them more pleasure than for Obama and Netanyahu to make some bellicose statements condemning them. Here is an example of how far they're willing to reach in order to drag us into it:
The Iranian Foreign Ministry, meanwhile, summoned the Swiss ambassador, who represents American interests in Tehran, to complain of “interventionist” statements by American officials, state-run media reported. . . . President Obama said a day earlier that it would be counterproductive for the United States “to be seen as meddling.” But he has also said he was “deeply troubled by the violence” in Iran and that democratic values needed to be observed. The Iranian Foreign Ministry officials, without being specific about which comments they were reacting to, expressed displeasure, the official IRNA news agency reported.
jazzcyclist
 
Posts: 10857
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:28 am

skiboo wrote:
SQUACKEE wrote:Dead man posting.


That ought to be the case. Look what happened to Mennisco when he went on his anti-Kraut rant. :lol:


Some rise from the dead. A Canadian, whose goose was cooked, has re-taken flight as a Pheonix i see.
SQUACKEE
 
Posts: 12885
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Heaven-In front of stereo listenin to re-mastered Beatles

Postby Daisy » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:44 am

skiboo wrote:Look what happened to Mennisco when he went on his anti-Kraut rant. :lol:

Look want happened to MJD when he tried to explain his lame joke about Hilary Clinton, or was it McCain, I forget.

SQUACKEE wrote:has re-taken flight as a Pheonix.

A phoenix? I always thought it was a ghost into winter sports.
Daisy
 
Posts: 13153
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Postby rasb » Wed Jun 17, 2009 2:21 pm

Meanwhile, all Canada goose jokes aside, (sorry, Captain Sully),
we are indeed living in interesting times (thanks, Confucius), as far as the Iranian situation is concerned.
The leaders are trying to blame the USA, when I think the Americans are showing tremendous restraint, and probably trying to restrain some of the hawks in Israel at the same time.
Also, the attempts to stifle communication from and to the outside world, do not seem to be working. It's a new world, and very difficult to just close borders anymore. It appears that the citizens of Iran (including a large percentage of the younger Iranians) are not going to go away quietly.
I hope for the best, but I fear the worst. The next 24 hours will be tense indeed in Tehran. Peace !!!
rasb
 
Posts: 2008
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 4:48 pm
Location: South of the 49th

Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest