Normally open July 4th only---the one day a year when partisan politics, religion, etc. are acceptable topics on this Board. (The 2012 window is now closed; thanks for playing.)
eldrick wrote:wiki quotes him as saying he was an "average" student at yale - getting into any ivy league college & excelling are 2 very different propositions ( i got into one equivalent in britain but was very poor student ) - besides his pa was also yale graduate & a member of house of representatives when W applied for colleges - i'd bet good money his father being an alumnus & congressman helped a lot with his application
as for his political career - i'd suggest most of all of it was due to name recognition of his father rather than any political acumen
If you're saying that he owes all of his major life accomplishments to his father and grandfather, I agree.
Former Secretary of State Larry Eagleburger and McCain supporterweighs in on Palin. With friends like these, who needs enemies. It funny how some the worst damage done to McCain and Obama, has been done by their own supporters.
McCain Larry Eagleburger
Phil Gramm
Michele Bachmann
John Hagee
Obama Joe Biden
John Murtha
jeremiah Wright
Michael Pfleger
gm wrote:It's amazing how well some of you personally know Palin. I am impressed. It's probably because Democrats are much, much more intelligent.
Not a Democrat, not a Republican, not a USAnian, and I don't know Sarah personally, so I have no dawgs in this race. However, I have listened to many of her public offerings, and she strikes me as one who believes she is right, even when she doesn't have a clue what she is talking about. Somewhat scary for a VP of the USA, imho.
gm wrote:It's amazing how well some of you personally know Palin. I am impressed. It's probably because Democrats are much, much more intelligent.
It's funny that you should mention that. In the last two elections, do you know how a person's education level corresponded to their voting preferences? I think you already know the answer, but I'll let you find out for yourself.
gm wrote:It's amazing how well some of you personally know Palin. I am impressed. It's probably because Democrats are much, much more intelligent.
Not a Democrat, not a Republican, not a USAnian, and I don't know Sarah personally, so I have no dawgs in this race. However, I have listened to many of her public offerings, and she strikes me as one who believes she is right, even when she doesn't have a clue what she is talking about. Somewhat scary for a VP of the USA, imho.
Well, Biden's incipient senility does scare me, so I can see your point.
gm wrote:Well, Biden's incipient senility does scare me, so I can see your point.
Now be honest. Would you really feel more comfortable with Palin as commander-in-chief than Biden?
GM, do you agree that support of Palin for 2012 should be the new litmus test for a real republican? Or would you feel more comfortable with other candidates and hope she finds a TV job?
gm (with full respect for your positions and opinions), When you talk about "incipient senility", you must be aware that there will be those who will vote against McCain for that very reason, especially with VP Palin waiting in the wings.
gm wrote:Well, Biden's incipient senility does scare me, so I can see your point.
Now be honest. Would you really feel more comfortable with Palin as commander-in-chief than Biden?
GM, do you agree that support of Palin for 2012 should be the new litmus test for a real republican? Or would you feel more comfortable with other candidates and hope she finds a TV job?
I don't have much to say about how the R's choose their candidate. The last R I voted for in a presidential election was Reagan.
jazzcyclist wrote:Great political acumen doesn't necessarily require great knowledge or intellect and no one illustrates this better than Sarah Palin.
Who has ascribed great political acumen to Palin?!
To get so far with so little requires great political acumen, IMHO.
I think Palin is a very good politician. Question is, if Obama wins, who do the Republicans throw up against him in '12? With four years to hone her knowledge and become better known nationwide, is she a viable presidential candidate?
Are there a lot of disillusioned Hillary fans out there who wouldn't defect for a woman as VP candidate, but might for a Prez?
No, she won't be a good candidate: 1) You never get a second chance to make a first impression. 2) Her politics scale well to Alaska, but will be too extreme for the general populace. She was brought in to shore up the base, while McCain could go after the independents.
As to who the ReShrublicans might put up in 2012, it takes one of two forms: 1) If Obama is a poor president, they will go to a "standard" candidate. Someone who is for God and country and can point to a record that basically says "I told you that Obama was a loser and his politics/values would ruin the country." Think Ronnie Ray-gun vs. Carter. 2) If Obama is a good president, they will put up a sacrifical lamb a la Bob Dole and put more energy into winning back the Congressional seats it looks like they will lose. However, it also means that they will start grooming someone for 2016 along the Obama lines - younger, articulate and positive, but with conservative values.
Basically the right-wing of the Republican party gets to say whether she goes away or not on the national political scene. If she is the best they have then go for it, because it means that they are doomed.
But of course, what do you expect them to say, "Hey, this is great. If she wins she's a hearbeat away from the Presidency, and if she loses, she can always slink back into the political obscurity whence she came"?
If Obama wins, then I think that in 2012, you'll see Democrats launch their own "Operation Chaos" a la Rush Limbaugh, by participating in the Republican primaries to help Palin get the nomination.
Basically the right-wing of the Republican party gets to say whether she goes away or not on the national political scene. If she is the best they have then go for it, because it means that they are doomed.
How many millions of ex-Republicans are there, just like myself ?! I did not leave the Republican Party; they left me.
Elizabeth Dole doubles down on the God card. Dole is no doubt trying to live up to the legacy of her predecessor, Jesse Helms. I'll be glad when these dinosaurs are all gone.
Per Andersen wrote:In America there is always very little room on the left and the Dems can never move far from the center if they hope for more than 4 years. As we have seen there is lots of room on the right.
That may be true, but it's only because the country has moved further to left over the last 40-50 years, which has had the effect of shrinking the amount of room on the left. Look at how far we've come on issues like civil rights, women's rights, gay rights and abortion. It's similar to an offense finding it harder to score once it gets inside the 20-yard line in a football game, because the defense no longer has as much ground to defend.
Greater civil rights are a far right issue. Civil rights legislation wins with Republican support, unlike Southern Democrats.
jazzcyclist wrote:That may be true, but it's only because the country has moved further to left over the last 40-50 years, which has had the effect of shrinking the amount of room on the left.
Others would argue we have been moving to the right, at least for the last 30 years:
Yet for partisans, it is the threat or hope of ideological change that matters most. The mood among conservatives has grown darker each day. Not only McCain but much of the conservative intellectual elite warn of an impending turn to European-style socialism at home and appeasement abroad, especially if Democrats seize a monopoly in Washington.
Historians call the fears exaggerated, a reflection of the country's 30-year rightward shift. On many issues, Obama is to the right of Nixon, the Republican who proposed a guaranteed income for all Americans, supported affirmative action, imposed wage and price controls, and established much of today's environmental regulation.
"A conservative in 1968 was far more liberal than a liberal is in 2008," said (Boston University historian Bruce) Schulman.
Vince wrote:Greater civil rights are a far right issue. Civil rights legislation wins with Republican support, unlike Southern Democrats.
Civil Rights broke down along the Mason/Dixon line, not partisan lines. Lyndon Johnson was a liberal Democrat, not a conservative Republican. And more Democrats than Republicans voted for both the 1964 Civil Rights Act, and the 1965 Voting Rights Act in both the House and the Senate. Furthermore, it is liberal Democrats who have always supported affirmative action, while conservative Republicans have always opposed it.
jazzcyclist wrote:It's funny that you should mention that. In the last two elections, do you know how a person's education level corresponded to their voting preferences? I think you already know the answer, but I'll let you find out for yourself.
"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative." John Stuart Mill
Vince wrote:Greater civil rights are a far right issue. Civil rights legislation wins with Republican support, unlike Southern Democrats.
Civil Rights broke down along the Mason/Dixon line, not partisan lines. Lyndon Johnson was a liberal Democrat, not a conservative Republican. And more Democrats than Republicans voted for both the 1964 Civil Rights Act, and the 1965 Voting Rights Act in both the House and the Senate. Furthermore, it is liberal Democrats who have always supported affirmative action, while conservative Republicans have always opposed it.
That's only because there were more Democrats in both houses. By the way Affirmitive Action isn't a civil right. Abraham Lincoln was a Republican.
jazzcyclist wrote:It's funny that you should mention that. In the last two elections, do you know how a person's education level corresponded to their voting preferences? I think you already know the answer, but I'll let you find out for yourself.
"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative." John Stuart Mill
I would certainly rather be stupid, than be a prick.
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Dole is no doubt trying to live up to the legacy of her predecessor, Jesse Helms. I'll be glad when these dinosaurs are all gone.