"Magazine Payment Services" - a scam??


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"Magazine Payment Services" - a scam??

Postby iflyboats » Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:04 pm

I have recieved a notice in the mail from a company called "MAGAZINE PAYMENT SERVICES" indicating that I need to pay $87.99 by November 28 to renew my T&FN subscription for two years. Is this a scam?
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Postby MJD » Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:21 pm

Probably-it has been covered in a couple of other threads.
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Postby tafnut » Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:22 pm

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Man lands on moon

Postby BillVol » Sat Nov 26, 2005 7:30 pm

Pearl Harbor bombed by Japanese.

:wink:
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Postby iflyboats » Sat Nov 26, 2005 8:09 pm

To be honest the name "MAGAZINE PAYMENT SERVICES" gives it away and I wasn't buying it for 2/3 of a second, but I wanted to post about it anyway because it pisses me off. Isn't this illegal?
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Postby Law dude » Sat Nov 26, 2005 8:21 pm

iflyboats wrote:To be honest the name "MAGAZINE PAYMENT SERVICES" gives it away and I wasn't buying it for 2/3 of a second, but I wanted to post about it anyway because it pisses me off. Isn't this illegal?

Yes.

Next question?
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Postby iflyboats » Sat Nov 26, 2005 10:52 pm

how's this for a next question. WHERE DID THEY GET MY INFORMATION??

and why does this shit continue if it is illegal?
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Postby lonewolf49 » Sun Nov 27, 2005 12:30 am

I was feeling left out because I did not get one of those scam renewals last week. but it is oK now, I got two this week.
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Postby dukehjsteve » Sun Nov 27, 2005 6:00 am

I still think that any and all of us that get this illegal and contemptible trash in the mail should CALL THEM, keep them on the phone as long as possible, then close it by telling the person on the other end that THEY ARE WORKING FOR CROOKS and should be ashamed. And/or, politely ask to "speak to your manager" and do it again. Can't hurt, might help, and will make each of us feel better.

But I too am puzzled as to how they continually stay in business, as I know the various athorities have been repeatedly advised of their illegal operation.
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Re: "Magazine Payment Services" - a scam??

Postby EPelle » Sun Nov 27, 2005 7:58 am

iflyboats wrote:I have recieved a notice in the mail from a company called "MAGAZINE PAYMENT SERVICES" indicating that I need to pay $87.99 by November 28 to renew my T&FN subscription for two years. Is this a scam?

Here is another site affected by the b.s.
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Postby Law dude » Sun Nov 27, 2005 8:13 am

iflyboats wrote:why does this shit continue if it is illegal?

Probably for reasons similar to those that explain how the genocide in Darfur continues. There are relatively few people or entities with the capacity to do anything about it, and they have other priorities that they think are more urgent or important.
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Postby Kevin Richardson » Mon Nov 28, 2005 6:38 am

If it helps soften the blow any for the hardcore fans on here, they are hitting Runners' World subscribers, also.
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Postby gh » Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:16 am

iflyboats wrote:how's this for a next question. WHERE DID THEY GET MY INFORMATION??


If you have a mailing list you make money selling it. But you license it for one-time usage, and sell it only to reputable people. Somebody--we'll never know who--who was "reputable" turned out not to be so much and resold the list to these people. Or some other nefarious method. Point is that they came into possession of a mailing list whenthey shouldn't have and have been abusing it. (And obviously we haven't been able to stop them.)

As a result, we quit selling our mailing list several years ago now, so the only subscribers who are getting these solicitations are those who were on the rolls back then. And they'll continue to troll as long as they get results. So the sad bottom line is that this is likely to continue for some time to come.
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Postby dukehjsteve » Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:38 am

For curiosity's sake only, are these people complete thieves ? Does everyone and anyone that sends these people money get nothing in return , or do some renewals actually wend there way back to T & F N ?
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Postby guru » Mon Nov 28, 2005 10:22 am

gh wrote:
iflyboats wrote:how's this for a next question. WHERE DID THEY GET MY INFORMATION??


If you have a mailing list you make money selling it. But you license it for one-time usage, and sell it only to reputable people. Somebody--we'll never know who--who was "reputable" turned out not to be so much and resold the list to these people. Or some other nefarious method. Point is that they came into possession of a mailing list whenthey shouldn't have and have been abusing it. (And obviously we haven't been able to stop them.)

As a result, we quit selling our mailing list several years ago now, so the only subscribers who are getting these solicitations are those who were on the rolls back then. And they'll continue to troll as long as they get results. So the sad bottom line is that this is likely to continue for some time to come.



No, the REAL bottom line is you have no one to blame but yourselves, and the decent thing to do when an unsuspecting subscriber(this thread proves, despite your warnings, they're still out there) sends money to these companies is to honor the renewal with a FUTURE warning sent INDIVIDUALLY to that person. You guys decided to sleep with dogs when you sold your mailing list, a reprehensible business move. YOU should deal with the fleas.
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Postby marknhj » Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:15 pm

To be fair to T&FN selling mailing lists is a pretty standard business practice. However, when the list is "sold" or liscensed, the buyer shouldn't actually get their hands on it; it should go to a bonded mailhouse and only be used once, plus the seller should authorise what is going to sent out.
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Postby guru » Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:18 pm

gh wrote: Somebody--we'll never know who--who was "reputable" turned out not to be so much and resold the list to these people.



All SAVVY businesses that sell their mailing lists put a "red herring" address into the list, always a DIFFERENT name each time it's sold, and usually the address used with the fake name is one of the company's employees or a PO Box. That way it's child's play to figure out who sold it second hand - just check which "bogus" addressee received the second hand mailing.

Guess you guys didn't do that.
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Postby gh » Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:45 pm

guru wrote:All SAVVY businesses that sell their mailing lists put a "red herring" address into the list, always a DIFFERENT name each time it's sold, and usually the address used with the fake name is one of the company's employees or a PO Box. That way it's child's play to figure out who sold it second hand - just check which "bogus" addressee received the second hand mailing.

Guess you guys didn't do that.


You mean just like TIME, Runner's World, Running Times, Coin World, Sports Illustrated, Fortune........

http://www.nydailynews.com/business/sto ... 5683c.html

These guys are very good at what they do, unfortunately. I assure you that we exercised all due diligence in attempting to maintain the sanctity of the lists. And rather than risk any further exposure, did the only 100% guaranteed thing to cure it, even if it meant revenue loss, which was to stop all (future) outside usage.
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Postby gm » Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:54 pm

guru wrote: You guys decided to sleep with dogs when you sold your mailing list, a reprehensible business move. YOU should deal with the fleas.


Reprehensible? Gimme a break, dude. It's a mailing list, and it's standard practice across the board with publications.
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Postby guru » Mon Nov 28, 2005 6:41 pm

gh wrote:These guys are very good at what they do, unfortunately. I assure you that we exercised all due diligence in attempting to maintain the sanctity of the lists. And rather than risk any further exposure, did the only 100% guaranteed thing to cure it, even if it meant revenue loss, which was to stop all (future) outside usage.



And I commend you for that. But the point is if you hadn't sold the lists in the first place, which I as a business owner would NEVER do, this would have never happened, "standard business practice" or not. Once you let them out in the public domain, without any "tracking" mechanism, don't be surprised if others sell them for revenue to a third party, legit or not.

And Time, SI, Runners World, etc. use just about every third party subscription service on the planet to push their magazines so they also shouldn't be surprised when a rogue agent or two also has hold of their subscriber list.
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Postby guru » Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:36 pm

gm wrote:
guru wrote: You guys decided to sleep with dogs when you sold your mailing list, a reprehensible business move. YOU should deal with the fleas.


Reprehensible? Gimme a break, dude. It's a mailing list, and it's standard practice across the board with publications.



My point, dude, is that I always am amazed at the fact a publication can sell their subscriber list for profit, then act like stunned victims when an unauthorized agent obtains that list and contacts their subscribers.
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