WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing


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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby toyracer » Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:11 am

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/2013 ... orts1.html

"It would seem as if John Fahey, president of the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA), and David Howman, its director general, are not on speaking terms." - More in article.

Finally. I wish that this information had been released on the 16th, pre-empting the tirade by Fahey. They could have prevented the sensational headlines, but of course JADCO doesn't think that way. Heads need to roll, they have clearly demonstrated their incompetence.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby gh » Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:12 am

This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby kamikaze7 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:51 am

norunner wrote:Kamakaze7: In Bolt's case most of the money comes from sponsors, so i don't think the taxation outside of Jamaica applies.


What about the rest of the athletes ? Will Bolt's sponsorship income sustain JADCO in perpetuity ?
And do we even know how much of Bolt's sponsorship income is taxed in Jamaica ?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby kamikaze7 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:53 am

bushop wrote:
Not crazy... I really did not know if she/ he was serious... but those numbers will never add up.

If we took all the tax dollars we pour into the small minority of students that participate in high school and college athletics and kept the money in the studios, workshops, gymnasiums and classrooms our educational system, and students, would be much better off.

The amount of dollars generated by athletic scholarships and professional salaries is tiny in comparison to the tax dollars set aside for scholastic sports. Someday the US American public will wake-up and our current dysfunctional system will end.

... and this does not take in to account all the time and energy given to sports. Sorry if I hijacked this thread.


First off no one said ALL the tax dollars should be poured into a minority. And secondly, my comment was aimed at countries with high youth unemployment rates. Your responses are completely off base.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Alucard » Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:59 am

gh wrote:This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?


So we do need to get the facts before we sound off. Calling Jumbo Elliott, Pego, Gabriella, Norunner, Mump,JWiz, JRM etc
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Trackrunner » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:23 am

Disappointed in Fahey and disappointed in WADA and their unprofessional conduct. Even if Fahey's version is true trying to air this out in the media is wrong, wrong, wrong. If Fahey got the blowoff from JADCO what protocol did he follow? Did he promptly send a letter to JADCO telling them that JADCO's response was unacceptable and the audit needs to be conducted this year or did he run to the media? This is even worse for WADA if the Gleaner's account is true. It seems to me that there is a lot of administrative bungling going on at all levels.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby bushop » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:29 am

kamikaze7 wrote:
bushop wrote:If we took all the tax dollars we pour...
First off no one said ALL the tax dollars...
Sorry for the confusion, I did not mean imply that the entirety of tax revenues... I was referring to all the tax dollars the US already pours into athletics.

kamikaze7 wrote:... secondly, my comment was aimed at countries with high youth unemployment rates. Your responses are completely off base.
As was mine. I cannot imagine a national economic structure that relies on sport to effectively address unemployment for any age... can anyone?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby JumboElliott » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:38 am

gh wrote:This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?

So everyone is incompetent in the anti-doping community.

Time to de-regulate.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Alucard » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:40 am

JumboElliott wrote:
gh wrote:This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?

So everyone is incompetent in the anti-doping community.

Time to de-regulate.

and maybe time to not prejudge
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby kamikaze7 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:41 am

As was mine. I cannot imagine a national economic structure that relies on sport to effectively address unemployment for any age... can anyone?


A national economic structure cannot rely on sports. But when you have high youth unemployment, you have to attack the problem from several different angles, including education, infrastructure creation, ow interest loans etc and yes SPORTS

Investing in sports does not just create employment opportunities for the athletes. It also employs coaches, physios, managers, journalists and so forth..............And as someone has pointed out, it can generate tax revenue and the income earned actually creates jobs at home.

In Kenya for example, there is the case of Daniel Njenga the marathon runner who has built a shopping mall in his hometown. Geb has constructed several hotels in Ethiopia. Many former Kenyan athletes have bought farms or other property on which they employ their fellow village-mates.
All this investment by athletes creates more jobs. And many of these athletes support entire extended families.

Sports is not the solution to high youth unemployment but it should be part of the solution. A government that ignores sports is simply missing out on opportunities to earn revenue.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby bushop » Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:01 am

kamikaze7 wrote:
As was mine. I cannot imagine a national economic structure that relies on sport to effectively address unemployment for any age... can anyone?
Investing in sports does not just create employment opportunities for the athletes. It also employs coaches, physios, managers, journalists and so forth... and as someone has pointed out, it can generate tax revenue and the income earned actually creates jobs at home.

Agreed.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Pego » Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:56 am

Alucard wrote:
gh wrote:This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?


So we do need to get the facts before we sound off. Calling Jumbo Elliott, Pego, Gabriella, Norunner, Mump,JWiz, JRM etc


Show me where I "sounded off".
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby JRM » Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:11 am

Pego wrote:
Alucard wrote:
gh wrote:This soap opera just gets better and better!

Check out front page for new story, which says that while Fahey was popping off, his director general had already set up the inspection visit to Jamaica next week. Left hand calling right?


So we do need to get the facts before we sound off. Calling Jumbo Elliott, Pego, Gabriella, Norunner, Mump,JWiz, JRM etc


Show me where I "sounded off".


Yes, same here. My comment was directed at jamboy's ironic (mis)use of quotes throughout this thread.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby eldanielfire » Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:40 am

jamboy wrote:WADA's audit of JADCO is scheduled to begin next week as reported tonight on Jamaican TV.

They will find nothing. No "secret" drug labs, positive test coverups etc.

All will be well.


That is a strawman. Nobody is claimed drug tests are covered up or secret labs. What they are debating is was there neglect or a lack of desire to implement stringent anti-doping measures or incompetence by Jamaica.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby shivfan » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:15 pm

On the front page....

"It would seem as if John Fahey, president of the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA), and David Howman, its director general, are not on speaking terms. Because while the former was reported exclusively in the Daily Telegraph on Monday as rebuking Jamaica for what he deemed 'farcical' attempts to defer an extraordinary audit of the Jamaica Anti-Doping Commission (JADCO) until 2014, Howman had from last week finalised arrangements for a team from WADA to visit Jamaica next week. Minister with responsibility for sports, Natalie Neita Headley, told The Gleaner last week that if a mutually convenient date could be agreed on, then WADA was free to visit to conduct their audit of JADCO. Further, word reaching The Gleaner is that on October 16, another invitation was sent to WADA and it was agreed that a team from world sports' doping governors would be arriving in Jamaica on October 28."

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/2013 ... orts1.html

John Fahey is an ass...the sooner he steps down, the better. And Leighton Levy is clearly a better athletics journalist that the morons who work for Reuters. He's better at ferreting out the truth than those jokers who write articles about Jamaica and JADCo "stonewalling"....

When I want the truth on this issue, I read Levy in the Gleaner, and Paul Reid in the Jamaica Observer.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby shivfan » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:22 am

So, now that the furor over the countless inaccuracies in the foreign press have died down, here are the facts:

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/latest/article.php?id=48825

"In a release from the Office of the Prime Minister, Jamaica Anti-Doping Commission (JADCO) said it wished to confirm that a three-member World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) team is expected in the island next week, October 28-29. JADCO said the date of WADA's visit was mutually agreed on by the two following an invitation by the Prime Minister in August. The WADA team will comprise of Director of Education Program and Development, Rob Koehler; Director of Standard Harmonization, Rune Andersen; and Manager of Program Development Kerwin Clarke."
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby norunner » Thu Oct 24, 2013 2:29 am

shivfan wrote:So, now that the furor over the countless inaccuracies in the foreign press have died down, here are the facts:

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/latest/article.php?id=48825

"In a release from the Office of the Prime Minister, Jamaica Anti-Doping Commission (JADCO) said it wished to confirm that a three-member World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) team is expected in the island next week, October 28-29. JADCO said the date of WADA's visit was mutually agreed on by the two following an invitation by the Prime Minister in August. The WADA team will comprise of Director of Education Program and Development, Rob Koehler; Director of Standard Harmonization, Rune Andersen; and Manager of Program Development Kerwin Clarke."
What facts? That's a press release from JADCO, you expect facts in a press release?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby toyracer » Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:04 am

Meanwhile, Dr Warren Blake continues to show his credentials.

In response to the WADA threat, Blake is quoted by The Times as saying "I don’t think it’s a possibility at all. What would London have been without Jamaica? What would 2012 have been without our athletes? It's not going to happen."

While it probably won't happen, that should never be the reason put forward by the head of any Federation for it not happening. That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Blues » Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:05 am

norunner wrote:
shivfan wrote:So, now that the furor over the countless inaccuracies in the foreign press have died down, here are the facts:

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/latest/article.php?id=48825

"In a release from the Office of the Prime Minister, Jamaica Anti-Doping Commission (JADCO) said it wished to confirm that a three-member World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) team is expected in the island next week, October 28-29. JADCO said the date of WADA's visit was mutually agreed on by the two following an invitation by the Prime Minister in August. The WADA team will comprise of Director of Education Program and Development, Rob Koehler; Director of Standard Harmonization, Rune Andersen; and Manager of Program Development Kerwin Clarke."
What facts? That's a press release from JADCO, you expect facts in a press release?


It's hard to know what the truth is since various sources could be biased... It seems that only Jamaican media sources have been suggesting that definitive and final arrangements for a WADA inspection next week were already in place when Fahey expressed his displeasure with JADCO in the Telegraph interview... Certain Reuters articles seem to suggest that JADCO's acceptance of next week's WADA visit was due to the extreme displeasure that WADA expressed over JADCO's initial refusal to be audited this year... And I'm not sure that the actual date of Fahey's interview (as opposed to Monday when the Telegraph first published the story) has been accurately revealed, so it's hard to develop a valid time frame of events.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby rabalac » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:05 am

toyracer wrote:That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.


...And yet after Beijing and London, the Jamaican team was the TALK OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES. They may be small in representation, but sure grab the attention of the world. Just sayin'.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby norunner » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:16 am

rabalac wrote:
toyracer wrote:That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.


...And yet after Beijing and London, the Jamaican team was the TALK OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES. They may be small in representation, but sure grab the attention of the world. Just sayin'.
Bolt grabbed the attention of the world, the rest of the jamaican team was just ordinary athletes.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby rabalac » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:29 am

[/quote]Bolt grabbed the attention of the world, the rest of the jamaican team was just ordinary athletes.[/quote]

Oh, I Beg to differ. The performance of the Jamaican TEAM between '08 and '13 is the reason why we have this 9-page thread going.
Last edited by rabalac on Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Pego » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:29 am

norunner wrote:
rabalac wrote:
toyracer wrote:That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.


...And yet after Beijing and London, the Jamaican team was the TALK OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES. They may be small in representation, but sure grab the attention of the world. Just sayin'.
Bolt grabbed the attention of the world, the rest of the jamaican team was just ordinary athletes.


Shelly-Ann is far from just an ordinary athlete.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby eldanielfire » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:57 am

rabalac wrote:
toyracer wrote:That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.


...And yet after Beijing and London, the Jamaican team was the TALK OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES. They may be small in representation, but sure grab the attention of the world. Just sayin'.


Usain Bolt grabs the attention of the world. Shelly-Ann Frazer-Price's 100m gold was easily over shadowed by Jessica Ennis' and Jamaica didn't win another gold without Usain Bolt.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby norunner » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:02 pm

rabalac wrote:Oh, I Beg to differ. The performance of the Jamaican TEAM between '08 and '13 is the reason why we have this 9-page thread going.
But we are T&F freaks, i could ask my friends, none of whom follow T&F, and not one of them would be able to name any jamaican athlete other than Bolt. I remember the reports on german TV during London, twice daily we got updates/background stories/etc on Bolt, we got ZERO reports on the rest of the jamaican team.
Pego: To us she isn't but to most of the world she is just another gold medal winner.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby JWiz » Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:04 pm

eldanielfire wrote:
Usain Bolt grabs the attention of the world. Shelly-Ann Frazer-Price's 100m gold was easily over shadowed by Jessica Ennis' and Jamaica didn't win another gold without Usain Bolt.


Lol wut? :lol:
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby 18.99s » Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:02 pm

norunner wrote:
rabalac wrote:Oh, I Beg to differ. The performance of the Jamaican TEAM between '08 and '13 is the reason why we have this 9-page thread going.
But we are T&F freaks, i could ask my friends, none of whom follow T&F, and not one of them would be able to name any jamaican athlete other than Bolt. I remember the reports on german TV during London, twice daily we got updates/background stories/etc on Bolt, we got ZERO reports on the rest of the jamaican team.


Right after Beijing, many non-Jamaican people I know who don't follow T&F were commenting on how incredible it is that Jamaica can win so many medals for such a small country. Some were positively amazed, others were negative ("they must be on drugs to win that many medals!"). The world may not have known or cared much about Jamaican athletes not named Bolt, but they seemed to be aware of Jamaica's medal haul.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby lionelp1 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 2:32 am

18.99s wrote:
norunner wrote:
rabalac wrote:Oh, I Beg to differ. The performance of the Jamaican TEAM between '08 and '13 is the reason why we have this 9-page thread going.
But we are T&F freaks, i could ask my friends, none of whom follow T&F, and not one of them would be able to name any jamaican athlete other than Bolt. I remember the reports on german TV during London, twice daily we got updates/background stories/etc on Bolt, we got ZERO reports on the rest of the jamaican team.


Right after Beijing, many non-Jamaican people I know who don't follow T&F were commenting on how incredible it is that Jamaica can win so many medals for such a small country. Some were positively amazed, others were negative ("they must be on drugs to win that many medals!"). The world may not have known or cared much about Jamaican athletes not named Bolt, but they seemed to be aware of Jamaica's medal haul.


People who don't follow track and field also do not know about so many great Jamaican born athletes who have performed at the highest level, including some, who have gone on to represent other countries, as the USA and even Linford.
So, who cares if Mr Blogs of some other country who knows sweet FA about track and is amazed cos he has seen on his television Bolt and Shelley Ann win medals lots of medals because at this period of time , merely a 6 year period so far, Jamaica possesses two, three or even four truly outstanding sprinters . Ten years from now it is going to look a little different, I believe. Beijing was a one off, imo.

Kenya is also a smallish country in relation to the giants of population elsewhere, but produces a predominance of and considerablty more great champions/ competitors in Marathon, long distance and steeplechase than they should do, but we get the endless reasons pumped out in the media , on this and other Forums etc, namely motivation, altitude, genetics, money etc etc.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby don1 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:11 am

From the Telegraph UK:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/others ... probe.html

"Embarrassingly for Fahey, it has now emerged that plans for next week’s Wada visit had already been agreed before he went public with his criticisms."


So is Mr. Fahey going to apologize for his outburst?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby shearer39 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:50 am

norunner wrote:
rabalac wrote:
toyracer wrote:That comes across as "the Olympics NEED Jamaica" and is more than a little bit arrogant. He needs to keep in mind that Jamaica takes part in a small percentage of Olympic events and is hardly mentioned at all during the first week.


...And yet after Beijing and London, the Jamaican team was the TALK OF THE OLYMPIC GAMES. They may be small in representation, but sure grab the attention of the world. Just sayin'.
Bolt grabbed the attention of the world, the rest of the jamaican team was just ordinary athletes.


Ordinary you say. Melaine Walker, gold medalist in Beijing and the second fastest woman of all time over the 400m hurdles is ordinary? VCB, gold medalist in the 200m, is also ordinary. As you can see there were also other gold medals won without Bolt, and had the women's 4x100m team not botched the pass on the third leg there would have been another gold added to that tally. Check yourself sir.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby user4 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:57 am

18.99s wrote:
norunner wrote:
rabalac wrote:Oh, I Beg to differ. The performance of the Jamaican TEAM between '08 and '13 is the reason why we have this 9-page thread going.
But we are T&F freaks, i could ask my friends, none of whom follow T&F, and not one of them would be able to name any jamaican athlete other than Bolt. I remember the reports on german TV during London, twice daily we got updates/background stories/etc on Bolt, we got ZERO reports on the rest of the jamaican team.


Right after Beijing, many non-Jamaican people I know who don't follow T&F were commenting on how incredible it is that Jamaica can win so many medals for such a small country. Some were positively amazed, others were negative ("they must be on drugs to win that many medals!"). The world may not have known or cared much about Jamaican athletes not named Bolt, but they seemed to be aware of Jamaica's medal haul.



Those of us that love Jamaica continue to be astounded that some find it odd that a small island of 3 million people could grab more than 1/2 the sprint medals at the OG and WC. It might just be jealousy that makes people doubt the prefect legitimacy of 19.2 second 200m dashes by Blake and Bolt.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Gabriella » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:31 am

shearer39 wrote: Check yourself sir.


No, YOu check YOURSELF. norunner has since clarified his statement, which makes perfect sense. Joe Public has never heard of Melaine Walker, but they have Bolt. Bolt was the talk of Beijing, not anyone else. Since then, and that is probably in the last 2 seasons, Joe Public is becoming more aware of other athletes, but it has taken time and the majority will certainly not know who Walker is, but they may now know who SAFP is (although I have just asked about 20 people in my office and none of them have heard of her, nor Yohan Blake though a couple have heard of VCB)
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby Kav » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:23 am

I'm really not sure if it is plain stupidity or ignorance on display, i don't want to believe that some people really have it out for a third world country to the degree that they would do anything to belittle or downplay their achievements any chance they get. This faux 1st world superiority i see on display is quite dumbfounding, especially when one considers the substance of the conversation keeps swaying from one minor issue to another. Please formulate proper talking points and leave the vitriol at home, that is for the uninformed. I would like to think the readers and posters here are some of the most educated track aficionados around, act like it people.


Fact: Jadco is incompetent, they lack proper structure, vision, leadership and management. That in itself is a major issue for Jamaica and any Serious track nation. However the assertions that their incompetence equates to systemic cheating does a great disservice to the athletes who are clean and have rightfully earned their medals or places in major championships.

Lastly i notice some of the more ardent critics are jumping around the place with their strawman arguments. Jumbo elliot please address Don1 post viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52246&start=150#p867675

I like to see a proper debate when it presents itself.

As for the previous poster, your cynical behaviour of anything Jamaican is truly sad, to say people have never heard of Jamaicans beside Bolt is just well garbage. That is like saying without Tyson Gay, US athletics is faceless.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby gh » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:39 am

Unfortunately, in the modern world, Gabriella is pretty close to spot-on in his analysis of "faceless" teams beyond the top-ender. It applies, in varying degrees, in all nations, to all everybody but the home team. Such is the state of the sport in the big picture.

And what's worse, of course, is that in the U.S., the "average man" would probably be hard-pressed to name even U.S. tracksters, no matter how famous. :-(
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby maroon » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:23 am

hmmm, i think this latest debate got started because toyracer stated that the jaaa president was arrogant for stating that the olympics needed jamaica. i agree with toyracer because the more accurate statement would be that the olymics need bolt, not the whole jamaican team. so jadco will lose their leverage with wada if bolt is out of rio due to injury or any other reason.

in fact, the more interesting question arising from toyracer's post is whether jadco's lackadaisical attitude towards arranging the wada visit was driven by the same arrogance behind dr. blake's statement that the olympics need jamaica. also interesting to know what made wada leak the fact that jadco was putting off the visit until next year. it was clearly a negotiating tactiic, but was it necessary?

anyway, as stated at the beginning of the thread, jadco has mishandled this whole affair. proper management of the fallout from shirley's article would have dictated getting a wada stamp of approval as soon as possible. why would they want to have the story linger into next year?
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby shearer39 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:59 am

Gabriella that co-workers of yours are ignorant to the accomplishments of certain athletes does not in any way detract from the athlete's accomplishments. It just speaks to the ignorance of your co-workers and Joe Public for that matter. Walker is to be inducted in Texas' Hall of Fame next month. That they also have not heard of VCB or few have, is also a great indicator of general ignorance of an athlete that has been winning titles ever since she was a junior athlete.

It also why some believe that Bolt was a "bolt from the blue" pardon the expression because they only heard about him in Beijing, oblivious to the fact that he is still the only junior to break 20 seconds. This is the ignorance that prompted Byrant Gumbel and Carl Lewis to question is legitimacy after he ran 10.03 and then 9.76. The 10.03 he ran the year before was his only 100m and his first. How many people run 10,03 on their first attempt. Bolt was the fastest 15, 16 and 17 year-old in history over 200m.

So don't use ignorance of an athlete's accomplishment as an argument to make the claim that an athlete is not great. A tree that falls in the forest does make some noise even if you dont hear it.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby toyracer » Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:18 am

maroon wrote:anyway, as stated at the beginning of the thread, jadco has mishandled this whole affair. proper management of the fallout from shirley's article would have dictated getting a wada stamp of approval as soon as possible. why would they want to have the story linger into next year?


Exactly.

In related news; there is a new head at JADCO.

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/2013 ... orts3.html

Hopefully he will be a man of action, in possession of a broom.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby norunner » Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:55 am

shearer39 wrote:Gabriella that co-workers of yours are ignorant to the accomplishments of certain athletes does not in any way detract from the athlete's accomplishments. It just speaks to the ignorance of your co-workers and Joe Public for that matter. Walker is to be inducted in Texas' Hall of Fame next month. That they also have not heard of VCB or few have, is also a great indicator of general ignorance of an athlete that has been winning titles ever since she was a junior athlete.

It also why some believe that Bolt was a "bolt from the blue" pardon the expression because they only heard about him in Beijing, oblivious to the fact that he is still the only junior to break 20 seconds. This is the ignorance that prompted Byrant Gumbel and Carl Lewis to question is legitimacy after he ran 10.03 and then 9.76. The 10.03 he ran the year before was his only 100m and his first. How many people run 10,03 on their first attempt. Bolt was the fastest 15, 16 and 17 year-old in history over 200m.

So don't use ignorance of an athlete's accomplishment as an argument to make the claim that an athlete is not great. A tree that falls in the forest does make some noise even if you dont hear it.
Are trying to misunderstand on purpose? Nobody is saying Walker or VCB or any other jamaican athletes aren't great athletes, we are saying like most other olympic champions they remain unknown to the vast majority of the public. How many olympic champions from Beijing can you name in sports other than T&F? Some of the greatest american sportsheroes are virtually unknown in Europe because almost nobody plays/follows baseball. Babe Ruth, Hank Aaron, Ty Cobb, Willie Mays, etc, household names in the US, all nobodies in Europe. Some may know Lou Gehrig because of "Pride of the Yankees", but thats it. And that's not ignorance, it's lack of interest. I wouldn't call all of America ignorant because nobody could name great soccer players.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby user4 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:50 pm

Kav wrote:Fact: Jadco is incompetent, they lack proper structure, vision, leadership and management. That in itself is a major issue for Jamaica and any Serious track nation. However the assertions that their incompetence equates to systemic cheating does a great disservice to the athletes who are clean and have rightfully earned their medals or places in major championships.


Exactly, and anyone of us that love track and Jamaica can see that it is purely a coincidence that JADCO incompetence coincided with the 3million person island pulling in the lion share of the world sprint medals. Erase the hate.
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Re: WADA launching probe into Jamaican testing

Postby JumboElliott » Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:08 pm

Kav wrote:
Lastly i notice some of the more ardent critics are jumping around the place with their strawman arguments. Jumbo elliot please address Don1 post viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52246&start=150#p867675

None of it is acceptable, but this thread is about Jamaica. That post was deflecting the blame from Jamaica.

I personally believe in a level playing field. That means deregulation. The fight against doping is a failed one.
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