NFL Positives


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NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:18 pm

OK, let's go to my least favorite sport - football. There are about 55 players on each NFL roster, and 32 teams, so about 1,760 players - a good mile of NFL players.

Now if the NFL players were subject to the same strict WADA testing - out-of-competition, unannounced tests, 24/7 testing, the entire WADA proscribed list, must make WADA aware of your whereabouts at all times - how many positives would there be per year?

My guess - somewhere between 750-1,000 - I'll give the QBs and kickers a pass and some of the wide receivers and D-backs. I'll assume everyone else is taking something, but a few will pass the test in some way.

What's everyone else guess for the number of + per year?
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby tm71 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:30 pm

bambam wrote:OK, let's go to my least favorite sport - football. There are about 55 players on each NFL roster, and 32 teams, so about 1,760 players - a good mile of NFL players.

Now if the NFL players were subject to the same strict WADA testing - out-of-competition, unannounced tests, 24/7 testing, the entire WADA proscribed list, must make WADA aware of your whereabouts at all times - how many positives would there be per year?

My guess - somewhere between 750-1,000 - I'll give the QBs and kickers a pass and some of the wide receivers and D-backs. I'll assume everyone else is taking something, but a few will pass the test in some way.

What's everyone else guess for the number of + per year?


like you said, not everyone is taking something and the ones who are taking something they arent all the time so it would certainly not anything close to 100 %. Even if 50 % test positive and have to be suspended, that would mean teams would have to go the "borrow" marginal players from other leagues (semi pro etc) to fill their roster. given the nature of the sport and huge amount of injuries, a lot of these "replacement" players would be seeing significant playing time and there would decreasing interest by the fans. hence a league like the NFL would never allow this extensive testing to exist in way, shape or form. yet somehow track and other olympic sports have survived to some extent with this stringent type of testing for the last 20 yrs.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby jazzcyclist » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:41 pm

Over 50% for sure. Mike Golic, of Mike & Mike fame, has admitted that he used steroids when he played and he talked as though it were a common practice.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:47 pm

Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:49 pm

Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby Pego » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:01 pm

bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.


These two intrigue me a bit, especially the NHL. Unlike MLB and NFL, these two send their players to the Olympics and the NHL also to the WC. Aren't they tested there?
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby tm71 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:10 pm

Pego wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.


These two intrigue me a bit, especially the NHL. Unlike MLB and NFL, these two send their players to the Olympics and the NHL also to the WC. Aren't they tested there?


yes some are tested at random, but very few from the entire roster. i dont remember the exact quote, but the NBA players did not like the idea of drug testing in the olympics at all because they were afraid several would test positive for canabinoids at the least !
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby jazzcyclist » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:46 pm

bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.

Does WADA and the IOC give the NHL the same pass they give NBA when it comes to random, out-of-competition testing?
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby gh » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:50 pm

Pego wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.


These two intrigue me a bit, especially the NHL. Unlike MLB and NFL, these two send their players to the Olympics and the NHL also to the WC. Aren't they tested there?


Can't speak for the WC, but they are tested at the Olympics (or are subject to testing, at any rate).
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:52 pm

jazzcyclist wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.

Does WADA and the IOC give the NHL the same pass they give NBA when it comes to random, out-of-competition testing?


I think so - I know they don't get tested all year like track & field and cycling.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby booond » Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:15 am

bambam wrote:Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."


Baseball players loaded up on speed before steroids.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby luther » Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:03 am

bambam wrote:Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."


No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:12 am

luther wrote:No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:


I'll name names when talking to you in person but not gonna do that over the Internet. Or are you trying to tell me it didn't happen?
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bad hammy » Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:36 am

luther wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."


No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:

Late 70s Phillies HOF player should be pretty easy to identify . . .
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby MJR » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:01 pm

bad hammy wrote:
luther wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."


No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:

Late 70s Phillies HOF player should be pretty easy to identify . . .


Hot corner protector who had to watch out for flying D cells on occasion. Has publicly come out saying he has no problems w/ "help".
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby luther » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:17 pm

bambam wrote:
luther wrote:No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:


I'll name names when talking to you in person but not gonna do that over the Internet. Or are you trying to tell me it didn't happen?


No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm either being too cryptic or I've got the wrong player.

45 in 78? Not my record collection. I'll shut up now....
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Wed Jul 17, 2013 2:10 am

MJR wrote:
bad hammy wrote:
luther wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - baseball - circa 1978 - I went to Phillies spring training because the PGA Tour was in Florida and I had a day or two so went over to Clearwater because I knew a few of the Phillies, especially a guy I went to college with. After practice that day he and I were in a bar together when a Phillies player walked in - very well-known, now in the Hall of Fame, who had one of the greatest single years in baseball history (trying to be vague here). I commented to my buddy that I had heard he had an incredible workout ethic. He agreed but also said that he took more drugs than any 3 other players on the team at that time - and Pete Rose was on the team (wasn't him). I asked my buddy if he was taking and he said "Sure. Everybody does. You have to to survive at this level."


No names - story ain't worth jack s*h*i*t :wink: :wink: :wink:

Late 70s Phillies HOF player should be pretty easy to identify . . .


Hot corner protector who had to watch out for flying D cells on occasion. Has publicly come out saying he has no problems w/ "help".


No, it wasn't Mike Schmidt
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby Dutra5 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:43 pm

bambam wrote:
MJR wrote:
bad hammy wrote:Late 70s Phillies HOF player should be pretty easy to identify . . .


Hot corner protector who had to watch out for flying D cells on occasion. Has publicly come out saying he has no problems w/ "help".


No, it wasn't Mike Schmidt


Everyone always thinks offense with steroids....mistakenly
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby dj » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:47 am

bambam wrote:


No, it wasn't Mike Schmidt[/quote]

"Workout ethic" is the key.

Also, I think what Mike Golic has spoken of is using steroids while recovering from injuries. I think this is more common than regular usage, as players in most team sports (individual sports also?) see the two situations as different.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby bambam » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:49 am

dj wrote:
bambam wrote:


No, it wasn't Mike Schmidt


"Workout ethic" is the key.

Also, I think what Mike Golic has spoken of is using steroids while recovering from injuries. I think this is more common than regular usage, as players in most team sports (individual sports also?) see the two situations as different.[/quote]

Yeah, I don't buy that injury stuff. Football players are always injured, so they can always be taking. Its a convenient euphemism for "Sure, I was taking" I love Golic on Mike & Mike but don't but that.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby user4 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 1:48 pm

bambam wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:
bambam wrote:Another sport - another story - this time the NHL. Good friend of mine was the team doctor for one of the NHL teams in the 1990s and he then came back on staff at Duke. We were talking about drug testing in the NHL and he said they didn't test, and the coaches, GMs, and executives didn't care and didn't want to know what anybody was using. All they wanted was somebody able to skate for 60 minutes at high speed and hit people very hard, and they didn't care what they were on. I don't know if its any better to this day - nobody ever tests positive in the NHL. Or the NBA for that matter.

Does WADA and the IOC give the NHL the same pass they give NBA when it comes to random, out-of-competition testing?


I think so - I know they don't get tested all year like track & field and cycling.


It always seemed to me that the US Olympic basketball dream teams seemed a bit less muscular than they do during a typical NBA season.
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Re: NFL Positives

Postby jazzcyclist » Sat Jul 20, 2013 2:30 pm

dj wrote:Also, I think what Mike Golic has spoken of is using steroids while recovering from injuries. I think this is more common than regular usage, as players in most team sports (individual sports also?) see the two situations as different.

The rationalizations that people give for doping are meaningless IMO for two reasons:

    1) Since we can't read minds, there's no way to ever know the true reason that a person doped.
    2) If a drug allows an injured player to get back on the field quicker, then by definition, it's a performance enhancer, since uninjured players perform better than injured players.
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