Weather Acting Funny in Your Neighbourhood?


A place for the discussion of all things not closely related to the sport and its competitive side. (as always, locked for the duration of major international championship)

Postby Mennisco » Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:53 pm

figo wrote:
tandfman wrote:Just a reminder that when science becomes political, it may cease to be good science.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/20/washi ... 8yJME5YGBQ


good science is largely a myth.
we're barely out of the dark ages.
but hey, we're doing pretty good for a bunch of hunter gathers.
one of these days we might actually have competent scientists, decent gentlemen and classy ladies.
i for one am working on it, but it's tough, you know, being a hunter gather with an advanced chimp brain.
i still like monkey business.


The notion the Earth has rights will enter our legal systems as we evolve.
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Postby figo » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:34 pm

we humans pretty much rape the planet.
but all life forms are pretty much greedy and self centered ,we're just an extension of that.
in nature, the winner takes all and all it can.

we should get busy evolving into something better.
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Postby tafnut » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:37 pm

figo wrote:i for one am working on it, but it's tough, you know, being a hunter gather with an advanced chimp brain. i still like monkey business.

TAFNY!
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Postby bad hammy » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:43 pm

figo wrote:we humans pretty much rape the planet.
but all life forms are pretty much greedy and self centered ,we're just an extension of that.
in nature, the winner takes all and all it can.

we should get busy evolving into something better.

In theory, unlike other life forms, we are now aware that we are raping the planet and could choose to be a bit kinder about it. Take her out to dinner, have a few drinks, you know . . .
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Postby figo » Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:32 pm

bambam wrote:
tandfman wrote:Just a reminder that when science becomes political, it may cease to be good science.


Which was virtually proven true in the late 19th century when the Indiana state legislature came within one vote of declaring it a law that, henceforth, the value of pi in Indiana would be 3. Just 3. Not 3 anything.


politicians baffled with "fancy" math...
greeks of 2500 years ago would not be impressed.
remember gore blew science....

http://arshermeneutica.org/besieged/Legislating_the_Value_of_Pi


The bill made it through three readings and votes in the House, and its first reading in the Senate. It was evidently seen as of economical benefit, since Indiana would save royalties on the patent, and the legislators proclaimed themselves unfit to comprehend the details of the bill anyway. The finale was dramatic and down to the wire:[4]

That the bill was killed appears to be a matter of dumb luck rather than the superior education or wisdom of the Senate. It is true that the bill was widely ridiculed in Indiana and other states, but what actually brought about the defeat of the bill is recorded by Prof. C.A. Waldo in an article he wrote for the Proceedings of the Indiana Academy of Science in 1916. The reason he knows is that he happened to be at the State Capitol lobbying for the appropriation of the Indiana Academy of Science, on the day the Housed passed House Bill 246. ... The roll was then called and the bill passed its third and final reading in the lower house. A member then showed the writer [i.e. Waldo] a copy of the bill just passed and asked him if he would like an introduction to the learned doctor, its author. He declined the courtesy with thanks remarking that he was acquainted with as many crazy people as he cared to know. That evening the senators were properly coached and shortly thereafter as it came to its final reading in the upper house they threw out with much merriment the epoch making discovery of the Wise Man from the Pocket.
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Postby figo » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:29 pm

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Postby MJD » Fri Mar 23, 2007 1:41 am

tandfman wrote:Just a reminder that when science becomes political, it may cease to be good science.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/20/washi ... 8yJME5YGBQ


Hilarious that the worst offender doesn't get mentioned in that article. Oh wait. Silly me. The NYT. Never mind.
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:09 pm

figo wrote:now this is what you want from your president, no?

Franklin D. Roosevelt quotes.

A nation that destroys it's soils destroys itself. Forests are the lungs of our land, purifying the air and giving fresh strength to our people.



A nation that soils its soil soils its soul?
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:12 pm

MJD wrote: there are some that consider certain other areas of the country to be like a totally foreign country or maybe even planet!


Like Saul Bellow? "California is like an artificial limb the rest of the country doesn't really need. You can quote me on that."

http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/34451.html
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Postby EPelle » Sat Mar 24, 2007 11:32 pm

Ýet some people from his state get artificial tans to look like people from that artificial limb.
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Postby Mennisco » Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:40 am

EPelle wrote:Ýet some people from his state get artificial tans to look like people from that artificial limb.


Great line from Absolutely Fabulous, Patsy:

"Who'd want to live in LA? Pert tits and a tight butt so you can fall down a crack in the earth with confidence."
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Postby EPelle » Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:20 am

Polar bears outside of Norway are now dying from what scientists attribute to the warmer climates melting the ices, causing them to be unable to chase seals where they normally do. Same has been stated of polar bears in Canada.

Some seals have been forced to birth their young on land due to the increased temperatures in the waters.

http://www.aftonbladet.se/vss/klimathot ... 10,00.html
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Postby SQUACKEE » Thu Apr 05, 2007 2:54 am

Todays paper calls for a wind-chill low sat. of 9 degrees f. MJD- it must be pretty cold up there, huh? Winter is back with teeth.

Heard that man is responsible for only 5% of all of the CO2 emissions in the world. Not saying its true, just heard it. :?
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Postby Mennisco » Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:28 pm

I still think you have to be from Mars to not be convinced of global warming, however, for the skeptics, we present this delicious tidbit:

"Mars experiences climate change too"


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ ... ience/home


Image
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Postby bad hammy » Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:47 pm

Mennisco wrote:
"Mars experiences climate change too"

Gore and figo can debate whether it is man-made. Probably the exhaust off of those little Mars rover things we've sent up there.
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Postby figo » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:11 pm

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/04/07/ap3591203.html

Global Warming
By CAIN BURDEAU 04.07.07, 12:28 AM ET
[cut by mods]
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Postby figo » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:12 pm

http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/sc ... 643955.php

Global warming on Mars
Causes of planet's heating believed to be different from those on Earth.
By DAVID PERLMAN
San Francisco Chronicle

Global warming has hit Mars, but the shifting winds and swirling dust that scientists theorize power climate changes there bear no relation to the heat-trapping gases that concern the people of Earth.

Researchers studying images of the Martian surface taken by generations of orbiting spacecraft have found that the planet's most prominent features have darkened and lightened in recent decades, altering the way sunlight reflects from its sandy soils, its rocky heights and its deep craters.

The result, say the scientists, is that average global ground temperatures on Mars have risen by more than 1.5 degrees Fahrenheit during the past two decades, while the surface air temperature has risen by a little more than a degree in the same period.

That level of climate change, extended over a century, is well within the ballpark of the 5 degree warming trend on Earth forecast by the International Panel on Climate Change for the end of this century.

A report on Mars's warming was published Thursday in the journal Nature by Lori Fenton, a planetary geologist with the SETI Institute's Carl Sagan Center in Mountain View, Robert M. Haberle, a climate model expert at NASA's Ames Research Center, and Paul Geissler, a Mars specialist at the U.S. Geological Survey in Flagstaff, Ariz.

On Earth, Fenton says, the recent decades of increasing global temperatures have been caused by increased emissions of industrial heat-trapping gases like carbon dioxide and methane, while on Mars, it's the darkening of many surface regions that allows the sun to warm the planet.

"Albedo" is the term for a planet's ability to reflect sunlight, and Mars' overall albedo has decreased since it was first measured from 1976 to 1978 by infrared detectors aboard the two orbiting Viking spacecraft whose landers searched for Martian life.

More than 20 years later, infrared heat detectors aboard the orbiting Mars Global Surveyor measured the planet's albedo and found it had darkened significantly.

The cause, according to Fenton, is a combination of high winds that periodically scour bright sand and dust from many rocky surface regions, fierce "dust devils" similar to those that whip desert sands on Earth, and truly major dust storms like the one in 2001 that literally wrapped itself around the planet before subsiding.

The causes of global warming on Mars – still not entirely understood, Fenton said – are not only far different from those on Earth, but so are the temperatures.

According to Fenton and her colleagues, the global average ground temperature on Mars measured by Viking's instruments was about 97 degrees below zero. When Mars Global Surveyor took measurements 22 years later, it had heated to 95 degrees below zero.

Whether warming persists depends on where and how the winds whirl the sands around and change the planet's albedo from bright to dark or back again, Fenton said.
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Postby figo » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:15 pm

http://newsbusters.org/node/11879

Australian TV Exposes 'Stranded Polar Bear' Global Warming Hoax
Posted by Noel Sheppard on April 6, 2007 - 12:05.

[cut by mods]
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Postby figo » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:41 pm

my position on this global warming thing remains unchanged, except from the study comes the conclusion that global warming and co2 is probably a good thing as the ice core data suggests a nasty cooling trend likely in the near future.

most of the warming is from the sun's cycles and earth, oceanic volcanoes.
a bit is coming from man.

that said, the global warmers best efforts may reduce pollution which is a serious problem.

another part of the thesis is that the global warming crowd in general lack the smarts to utilize capital effectively.

united nations expert reports should be disregarded because that organization is corrupt and disfunctional.

in the end, global warmers and critics have little control on the earths climate.
the point of the whole anti-global warming thing in my view is to limit funds to foolish groups and to discourage fascist tactics against scientists that
are voicing their best opinions.

so say no to fascists always and say no to people who discourage looking at both sides of any argument.

f politically correct, its the voice of the mediocre.
mediocre gets you where?
toward or back to the stone age.
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Postby cullman » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:01 am

FYI...record highs today after having snow a couple of days ago.

cman
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Postby EPelle » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:10 am

Isn:t that what the spring season provides -- unpredictability in terms of cold one day, warm the next?
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Postby cullman » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:26 am

We're used to pretty moderate weather changes in Vancouver. Usually it's rain followed by more rain which is occassionally interrupted with showers. :shock:

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Postby EPelle » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:55 am

Ouch :-) Must take some getting used to!
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Postby MJD » Sat Apr 07, 2007 7:52 am

A UN panel released a report yesterday. Covered in depth on The Newshour last night. Sound clip here:

http://media.pbs.org/ramgen/newshour/ex ... rming28.rm


Transcript here:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/environm ... 04-06.html


This might surprise some people:

"On the other hand, I think, by and large, the U.S. government played a constructive role. But the document is, in some aspects, probably weaker than some of the scientists would have it. But on looking it over carefully after I got off the plane, I thought it's a -- if I might say so myself -- I think it's quite a good piece of work."
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Postby gm » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:02 am

DAMN GLOBAL WARMING!
It is frigid and wet for the Texas Relays, and I want answers from those evil people controlling the global warmerizing machine!
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Postby MJD » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:34 am

I am staring at a good old fashioned blizzard right now outside my office window.
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Postby SQUACKEE » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:52 am

I went for a 6 miler this mornin and it was so cold my face was numb! Its global cooling i tell ya. :D
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Postby gh » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:05 am

figo wrote:http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/04/07/ap3591203.html

Global Warming
By CAIN BURDEAU 04.07.07, 12:28 AM ET

Copyright 2007 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed


Figo--what part of that last (which was in your original post, which I cut 99% of) do you not undestand? Continue posting these articles in toto and you're banned. Period.
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Postby bad hammy » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:22 am

Ah man, you cut my rip on figo for being more long winded than Al Gore!
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Postby DrJay » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:06 am

The dogwoods bloomed about three weeks early in Louisville this year, according to Mom, and it's 32F there right now.
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:44 am

gh wrote:in toto


Image
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Postby malmo » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:07 am

I thought there was a 'consensus' Mr Gore?

NEW ORLEANS (AP) - A top hurricane forecaster called Al Gore "a gross alarmist" Friday for making an Oscar-winning documentary about global warming.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070407/D8OBK1DG0.html
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Postby SQUACKEE » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:14 am

malmo wrote:I thought there was a 'consensus' Mr Gore?

NEW ORLEANS (AP) - A top hurricane forecaster called Al Gore "a gross alarmist" Friday for making an Oscar-winning documentary about global warming.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070407/D8OBK1DG0.html


I dont know if "Global warming" is caused by man. I do know there are many, many experts and scientists who disagree with the Doom-dayers Christ figure.
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Postby malmo » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:14 am

tandfman wrote:
I think the Electoral College is an anachronism, totally irrelevant to today's society and political environment. Yet there seems to be not a whisper on either side of the aisle to get rid of it. I don't understand this, but I'm not a politician, so I guess I'm not supposed to.


You're right, you don't understand it. The Electorial College is NOT an anachronism at all. It doesn't even come close the the defintion of the word. The Electorial College is simply a mirror image of the way our Federal Government is set up. The States send their representatives (ie votes) to Congress in the Legislative Branch. The States get an equal representation of votes for the Executive Branch as well.
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Postby malmo » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:18 am

SQUACKEE wrote:I dont know if "Global warming" is caused by man. I do know there are many, many experts and scientists who disagree with the Doom-dayers Christ figure.


The primary greenhouse gas is water vapor (95 percent). Manmade CO2 is responsible for 0.117 percent of greenhouse gases. Hopefully the Supreme Court, in all their wisdom, allows the EPA to call water vapor a pollutant so we can get down to the real root of the imaginary problem.
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:40 am

malmo wrote:Hopefully the Supreme Court, in all their wisdom, allows the EPA to call water vapor a pollutant so we can get down to the real root of the imaginary problem.


Vanishing trees? I admit I know next to nothing about this issue, [blushing, bowed head], and I am simultaneously curious to hear both sides of the debate. (1) If you had to play devil's advocate, how would you approach the figure you quoted on human contribution to CO2 emissions, and (2) from your perspective, how does the presentation of that statistic amount to an impartial [no pun] analysis of the situation?
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Postby malmo » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:01 pm

Mennisco wrote:
malmo wrote:Hopefully the Supreme Court, in all their wisdom, allows the EPA to call water vapor a pollutant so we can get down to the real root of the imaginary problem.


Vanishing trees? I admit I know next to nothing about this issue, [blushing, bowed head], and I am simultaneously curious to hear both sides of the debate. (1) If you had to play devil's advocate, how would you approach the figure you quoted on human contribution to CO2 emissions, and (2) from your perspective, how does the presentation of that statistic amount to an impartial [no pun] analysis of the situation?


I don't understand your question. Speak Merikan, please.
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Apr 07, 2007 3:21 pm

"The primary greenhouse gas is water vapor (95 percent). Manmade CO2 is responsible for 0.117 percent of greenhouse gases. Hopefully the Supreme Court, in all their wisdom, allows the EPA to call water vapor a pollutant so we can get down to the real root of the imaginary problem."

In all sincerity, ah' have not eyeball much on dis issue. But ah' am curious, dig dis: Maybe ah' misdig it yo' point, but ain't 0.117 some kinda small number? So's why such some big fuss upside such some little number? Why all de hoopla?
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Postby Mennisco » Sat Apr 07, 2007 7:00 pm

"Manmade CO2 is responsible for 0.117 percent of greenhouse gases......imaginary problem"

OK, sorry, I wasn't clear on where I was coming from in my first post a few above this. And then I used the wrong "Merickan dialect to rephrase it! :wink:

You've given us a statistic, and I am genuinely curious: It sounds to my layman's ears like man-made CO2 represents a miniscule contribution to greenhouse gases, eg., 0.117% is not much. At the risk of sounding like an airhead, I'm wondering why all the fuss [over CO2 emissions], globally, if this is the case.

I better get up to speed on this topic. It's actually somewhat embarrassing to be a teacher and know so little about it.
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Postby EPelle » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:44 pm

Often held under sunny skies in front of a full house at 20,000-seat Myers Stadium, the final day of the 80th edition of the Relays unfolded in conditions better suited for the Iditarod. Temperatures hovered in the mid- to upper 30s. There was precipitation — some of it icy. All that was lacking was snowshoes and sleds — as well as snow, which was falling elsewhere in Texas.

http://www.statesman.com/sports/content ... 7&cxcat=54

The weather has turned freezing. The course has turned into Augusta Nasty-al. The greatest players in the world have turned frantic.

In the previous 70 years of the Masters, nothing higher than even par was in front after 54 holes. Take that record and toss it into Rae's Creek.

http://www.sportsline.com/golf/tourname ... y/10114667
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