Winter's here


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Winter's here

Postby DrJay » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:05 pm

It's snowing and 12F, on the way down to -6F tonight and a high of +5F tomorrow. Everyone here is acting like it's the next Ice Age or something. Any midwesterners out there remember the January's of 1977 and 1978? I was in 9th and 10th grades and in '77 it snowed a few days then this Arctic air mass pushed south and in Louisville it didn't get above 0F for three or four days. Louisville shut down for about ten days. Indiana University closed due to a heating plant problem. "Roots" was on TV the whole week so being off school and having no homework was cool. The next year, it snowed a few times small, then 16-18" overnight, a record at the time for the River City, and we missed school for at least a week (one of the years I think it was two consecutive weeks, can't recall which). My running ground to a halt, though a year later I would not have allowed it to. I'm sure our Canuck and Buffalo and Minnesota friends out there would scoff at my recollections as routine for them, but it was harsh weather for the Ohio Valley.
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Re: Winter's here

Postby tafnut » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:12 pm

DrJay wrote:It's snowing and 12F, on the way down to -6F tonight and a high of +5F tomorrow. Everyone here is acting like it's the next Ice Age or something.


Huh?! It was warm and sunny (again *yawn*) today. Ran in a tank top, which I didn't need (except to keep the ladies from chasing me). What was that symbol you put in front of 6F? I don't recognize it. And why did you not put the 0 after the 6?

We did have a frigid cold front passage last night. Had to put a sheet over me in bed. Also put the ceiling fan on low.
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Postby DrJay » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:23 pm

Ah, but if you're gloating and trying to put me into a funk, it just won't work because I love the changing seasons and even the bitter cold weather. Running while it's snowing is great, until it gets too deep for safe footing. I'd go out for a run right now except we're hosting the g-d office Xmas party at our house this weekend and I've got to go buy the beer/wine and do other preparatory things.
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Re: Winter's here

Postby bad hammy » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:29 pm

tafnut wrote:
DrJay wrote:It's snowing and 12F, on the way down to -6F tonight and a high of +5F tomorrow. Everyone here is acting like it's the next Ice Age or something.


Huh?! It was warm and sunny (again *yawn*) today. Ran in a tank top, which I didn't need (except to keep the ladies from chasing me). What was that symbol you put in front of 6F? I don't recognize it. And why did you not put the 0 after the 6?

We did have a frigid cold front passage last night. Had to put a sheet over me in bed. Also put the ceiling fan on low.

Sunny, clear, 60F today. Plus we bypass all of that FL humidity and those hurricane thingys. :wink:
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Re: Winter's here

Postby SQUACKEE » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:38 pm

tafnut wrote:
DrJay wrote:It's snowing and 12F, on the way down to -6F tonight and a high of +5F tomorrow. Everyone here is acting like it's the next Ice Age or something.


Huh?! It was warm and sunny (again *yawn*) today. Ran in a tank top, which I didn't need (except to keep the ladies from chasing me). What was that symbol you put in front of 6F? I don't recognize it. And why did you not put the 0 after the 6?

We did have a frigid cold front passage last night. Had to put a sheet over me in bed. Also put the ceiling fan on low.


come july your a gonna be a frying like a piece of bacon. fire ants feasting on your privates. lightening cooking your brain. hurricane force winds blowing away your picture of you and alan webb. and by far the worst. uncle squackee coming to visit again.
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Postby marknhj » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:44 pm

A trifle Uncle Willy here too...67F, am considering putting the heat on :)
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Postby maggot » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:57 pm

It is rather cold in AZ these days. The low at my house today was 32F(0C). The high was in the low 60'sF(16C). My crankshaft was rather cold when I rode my bike to work this morning, Distance=22km.
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Postby tafnut » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:59 pm

marknhj wrote:A trifle Uncle Willy here too...67F, am considering putting the heat on :)


I get it! "Uncle Willy" rhymes with "chilly"!

Saw that on a PBS special on how weird Londoners talk! Smacks a little Clockwork Orangey, now duddinhit?
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Re: Winter's here

Postby maggot » Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:04 pm

DrJay wrote: Any midwesterners out there remember the January's of 1977 and 1978?

I lived in the Cleveland are at that time and remember it vividly. The snow and cold never stopped. My all-time record for a run was on a day when the temperature was -21F(-29C) and the wind chill was -50F(-45C). When I went to work the next day, a coworker told me that she and her husband were out driving the previous day and he said, "Look at that idiot out running." She said, "Hey, I know that idiot." It seemed to me that it might have been more dangerous to be out driving.
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Postby MJD » Tue Dec 06, 2005 4:51 pm

DrJay wrote:Ah, but if you're gloating and trying to put me into a funk, it just won't work because I love the changing seasons and even the bitter cold weather. Running while it's snowing is great, until it gets too deep for safe footing. I'd go out for a run right now except we're hosting the g-d office Xmas party at our house this weekend and I've got to go buy the beer/wine and do other preparatory things.


Ditto. Going skiing this week-end. Hopefully, I will hit 60 days for the first time.
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Re: Winter's here

Postby guru » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:26 pm

tafnut wrote:
DrJay wrote:It's snowing and 12F, on the way down to -6F tonight and a high of +5F tomorrow. Everyone here is acting like it's the next Ice Age or something.


Huh?! It was warm and sunny (again *yawn*) today. Ran in a tank top, which I didn't need (except to keep the ladies from chasing me). What was that symbol you put in front of 6F? I don't recognize it. And why did you not put the 0 after the 6?

We did have a frigid cold front passage last night. Had to put a sheet over me in bed. Also put the ceiling fan on low.



I'll remember that next July when I'm biking on a warm sunny summer morning and you're dodging a 20 foot surge of water and picking your roof up a mile down the road.

And then doing a week later.

Then two more weeks later.

:P
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Re: Winter's here

Postby tafnut » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:33 pm

guru wrote:I'll remember that next July when I'm biking on a warm sunny summer morning and you're dodging a 20 foot surge of water and picking your roof up a mile down the road.


We have just two words for that situation: Surf's Up!
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Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Dec 07, 2005 3:39 am

come july your a gonna be a frying like a piece of bacon. fire ants feasting on your privates. lightening cooking your brain. hurricane force winds blowing away your picture of you and alan webb. and by far the worst. uncle squackees coming to visit again. :o

oh and i almost forgot. im bringing a few suprise guests. no, not stacy 8)
malmo :twisted: and accelerator :twisted: have commited although accelerator :twisted: says he cant make the trip to jax. until victor conte gets out of club fed??? isnt that weird? :?


and im not doin the dishes! :x

p.s. ever since we bought a hot tub i welcome the cold :wink:
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Re: Winter's here

Postby Helen S » Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:48 am

My all-time record for a run was on a day when the temperature was -21F(-29C) and the wind chill was -50F(-45C).

I ran a 3 mile XC one December- temp had gotten down to -25 that night, but by race time, it was up to -15. it was the 25mph wind off the lake that was the kicker (i think -85 wind chill?), but the 8 inches of fresh snow did not help any.
We had 3 runners and 4 spectators, who sat in a car to jump out to take pictures every time we came by.
The next winter, it was 60 degrees warmer for the race.
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Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:08 am

in detail- what did you wear for that extreme cold?
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Postby maggot » Wed Dec 07, 2005 12:04 pm

How many people in the U.S. know that -40F=-40C? (FYAO)
Last edited by maggot on Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tandfman » Wed Dec 07, 2005 12:21 pm

maggot wrote:How many people in the U.S. know that -40F=-40C?

The few there are probably either scientists or those who have actually experienced being in that kind of cold. My PR is -30F. That's cold enough.
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Postby lonewolf » Wed Dec 07, 2005 1:16 pm

I looked out the (frosty) window at -70 F while on a seismic crew in northern Alberta circa 1968. Those guys are rugged but they actually suspend outdoor work when it gets F40ish below.
I saw Indian/Eskimo kids in Inuvik , NWT playing baseball at 10F on a balmy spring day in April in sweaters and windbreakers, no caps. Funny thing, they advanced around the bases clockwise. It was too cold to go out and ask why.
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Postby AKMarmoset » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:03 pm

Funny this topic should come up - my face is covered in nasty scabs right now from the frostbite I incured last Saturday. It was a fifteen-miler, thought it was only -18 out but it turned out to be -27 to -30 in the low spots (about half of the loop). I think what got me was the slight headwind for the first five miles, plus all the damn traffic going by; my right cheek is definitely a lot worse from taking those hits. Thankfully I was wearing good windbriefs, augmented by the ever-useful grocery bag (inserted after those first five frigid miles).

I may look like a housewife attacked my face with a hot iron, but I'd still take that over Squackee's lovely scenario.
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Postby SQUACKEE » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:14 pm

AKMarmoset wrote:Funny this topic should come up - my face is covered in nasty scabs right now from the frostbite I incured last Saturday. It was a fifteen-miler, thought it was only -18 out but it turned out to be -27 to -30 in the low spots (about half of the loop). I think what got me was the slight headwind for the first five miles, plus all the damn traffic going by; my right cheek is definitely a lot worse from taking those hits. Thankfully I was wearing good windbriefs, augmented by the ever-useful grocery bag (inserted after those first five frigid miles).

I may look like a housewife attacked my face with a hot iron, but I'd still take that over Squackee's lovely scenario.


god bless ya akmarmoset! keeping it real in spite of the fact you might need a face transplant! what about some kinda gel on your face before the run?
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Postby JRM » Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:11 pm

tandfman wrote:
maggot wrote:How many people in the U.S. know that -40F=-40C?

The few there are probably either scientists or those who have actually experienced being in that kind of cold. My PR is -30F. That's cold enough.


My wife and I went to Quebec City about 6 years ago in early March, following the CIAU Championships in Montreal. It never rose about -15C the entire time we were there, and one morning while we were taking pictures in front of the Chateau Frontnac, the temperature dropped below -40C.... Never again!

Right now, it's a chilly 9.5C outside... who said California was always warm?!
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Postby bad hammy » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:35 am

JRM wrote:Right now, it's a chilly 9.5C outside... who said California was always warm?!

Impossible! Last time I checked, CA was still (barely) part of the US. We do not do this celsius stuff. Now if you said it was 49F, then we're with you.
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Postby MJD » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:02 am

1F on the way to work this morning. Not much wind-run should be great. AK, and the medical types can correct me if I'm wrong, I think that once you get frostbite in a particular part of the body, that part will be vulnerable to the ailment in the future.

edit-great day for a run-slightly overdressed-should have gone with a t-shirt under the jacket instead of a long sleeved shirt.
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Postby Helen S » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:41 am

It was a while ago, but I suspect tights, warmup pants, and windpants over those. Numerous layers of shirts and jackets- cotton shirts, a $10 sears fiberfill jacket with more on top of that. Scarf, 2 hats, gloves, mittens, and home made goretex covers. I did get a touch of freezing on the right cheek (facing the wind) and either right ear or tip of nose- don't remember which.
After the "race" we ran farther on the lee side of the park- without the wind, we warmed up and the white spots on my face thawed.
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Postby gh » Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:03 am

I remember growing up we always used to say that once it got below zero (F)--which it did just about every winter--it didn't make any difference.

I changed my opinion on that the one time I experienced 50 below (minus 60C?). Every breath hurt (walking, let alone running). I could swear there was a definite metallic clinking when the snow fell.

Battery on the car died, and I discovered when I brought it in the house that if you took the caps off and turned it upside down nothing came out, because the acid had frozen!
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Postby JRM » Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:23 pm

bad hammy wrote:
JRM wrote:Right now, it's a chilly 9.5C outside... who said California was always warm?!

Impossible! Last time I checked, CA was still (barely) part of the US. We do not do this celsius stuff. Now if you said it was 49F, then we're with you.


My Weatherbug monitor is set in C. I still can't grasp what 49F means. Have to do the mental calculation (subtract 30, divide by 2).
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Postby MJD » Thu Dec 08, 2005 3:12 pm

Come one JRM, a mathie like yourself can do better than that. Subtract 32 and multiply by 5/9ths. That's what I do and always will. I have to go the other way. Multiply by 9/5ths and add 32.
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Postby AKMarmoset » Thu Dec 08, 2005 3:52 pm

MJD, I'm wondering where you live. It's actually colder there than Fairbanks right now - we're getting a huge push of warm air from the gulf (if I remember right) and it was at least twenty degrees just now on my run.

You're right about the frostbite - I've done my ears so many times now that I don't even notice (not good) and realize a week later when they start peeling.

To anyone running in cold conditions regularly - the best stuff you can wear for running in the cold is made by Ibex. Expensive, but I make $8000/year and still find it worth my money.
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Postby MJD » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:01 pm

Brantford, Ontario and right now this minute I am in Ellicottville NY which is snow belt country and it looks it.
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Postby guru » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:31 pm

AKMarmoset wrote:... I make $8000/year....



That's about what the Permanent Fund pays out each year, isn't it(though I think it's on a sliding scale depending on length of residency)?
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Postby JRM » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:16 pm

MJD wrote:Come one JRM, a mathie like yourself can do better than that. Subtract 32 and multiply by 5/9ths. That's what I do and always will. I have to go the other way. Multiply by 9/5ths and add 32.


The method I suggested is better for me. My forte is theoretical physics, not addition (ask my wife). If there's no computer to do the number crunching for me, I'm hopeless. :o
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Postby gh » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:51 pm

rather than worrying about 5/9ths and 9/5ths, multiply or divide by 1.8.
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Postby donley2 » Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:35 pm

It got down to 12F at my house last night in Fort Worth. I decided during college (which was only a couple hours north of where I grew up in southern Kansas) that North was the wrong direction to move. Never have liked the cold and certainly don't ever plan to move to anyplace that is colder than this area is.
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Postby MJD » Fri Dec 09, 2005 4:21 am

gh wrote:rather than worrying about 5/9ths and 9/5ths, multiply or divide by 1.8.


I disagree. My way is easier to do in your head. I am always going from Celsius and 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35 and 40 are easy to convert with my rule because of the multiplication rules we all learned about 9 and it is easy to divide by 5.
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Postby JRM » Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:33 am

MJD wrote:
gh wrote:rather than worrying about 5/9ths and 9/5ths, multiply or divide by 1.8.


I disagree. My way is easier to do in your head. I am always going from Celsius and 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35 and 40 are easy to convert with my rule because of the multiplication rules we all learned about 9 and it is easy to divide by 5.


Did you memorize log tables as a child, MJD? :lol:

For quick calculations, divding by 2 is much easier than dividing by 1.8 (because for practical purposes, 1.8 is approximately 2 anyway). Ditto for subtracting/adding 30 vs 32. This gives 90F = (90-30)/2 = 60/2 = 30C, as opposed to the actual 32C, and 40F = 5C (actual 4.4C). So, for most temperatures there's a margin of error of about 10% or less (the higher error being for low temperatures, but since they don't exist in CA, no worries!).
Last edited by JRM on Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tafnut » Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:42 am

JRM wrote:For quick calculations, divding by 2 is much easier than dividing by 1.8 (because for practical purposes, 1.8 is approximately 2 anyway). Ditto for subtracting/adding 30 vs 32. This gives 90F = 30C, as opposed to the actual 32C, and 40F = 5C (actual 4.4C). So, for most temperatures there's a margin of error of about 10% or less (the higher error being for low temperatures, but since they don't exist in CA, no worries!).


All this tomfoolery could be avoided if you metriphiles would just accede to the inevitable superiority of the Imperial System and CONVERT YOURSELF (as opposed to constantly converting measurements like decigrams and gigameters) to Jehovah's own annointed system (well actually that would be cubits and spans, but that's just so Old Testament).

16 ounces to the pound . . . 12 inches to the foot . . . 180 degrees from freezing to boiling - c'mon now - what could possibly be more logical?!
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Postby MJD » Fri Dec 09, 2005 5:55 am

JRM wrote:
MJD wrote:
gh wrote:rather than worrying about 5/9ths and 9/5ths, multiply or divide by 1.8.


I disagree. My way is easier to do in your head. I am always going from Celsius and 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35 and 40 are easy to convert with my rule because of the multiplication rules we all learned about 9 and it is easy to divide by 5.


Did you memorize log tables as a child, MJD? :lol:

For quick calculations, divding by 2 is much easier than dividing by 1.8 (because for practical purposes, 1.8 is approximately 2 anyway). Ditto for subtracting/adding 30 vs 32. This gives 90F = (90-30)/2 = 60/2 = 30C, as opposed to the actual 32C, and 40F = 5C (actual 4.4C). So, for most temperatures there's a margin of error of about 10% or less (the higher error being for low temperatures, but since they don't exist in CA, no worries!).


It's obvious you don't do distance JRM. 10& is a lot. Funny thing about the log tables. We started taking the base system in grade 4. I did reasonably well in school but had a complete mental block on that stuff. Whatever caused it just quickly cleared up one day after a couple of weeks. Incredibly frustrating in the interim.
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Postby JRM » Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:31 am

tafnut wrote:16 ounces to the pound . . . 12 inches to the foot . . . 180 degrees from freezing to boiling - c'mon now - what could possibly be more logical?!


A quick lesson on the importance of the metric system (and numerical estimation techniques!) from Canada's national newspaper, for ye American naysayers:

http://www.execulink.com/~bobnet/hoser/back/v8n9.html

Image Image

Bob: We should go metric.

Doug: Why?!

Bob: Then we could drink a beer every kilometre, not every mile.

Doug: So?

Bob: So... kilometres are shorter than miles!

Doug: AH! So we drink more beers.

Bob: Exactly. What's the conversion factor to go from miles to kilos?

Doug: Uh. Double it, and add thirty.

Bob: No, get out! That's temperature.

Doug: So, it's still metric.

Bob: Okay. So how many beers could we have had, professor Doug, assuming we drank twelve each?

Doug: Um. Hey! Are you implying one of us, possibly me, drank more than twelve?

Bob: Wha? No, I'm just sayin' it makes the math easier...
Last edited by JRM on Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:37 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby JRM » Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:32 am

MJD wrote:We started taking the base system in grade 4. I did reasonably well in school but had a complete mental block on that stuff. Whatever caused it just quickly cleared up one day after a couple of weeks. Incredibly frustrating in the interim.


Obviously a temporary... LOG jam!! Har har har.. :roll:
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Postby tandfman » Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:48 am

MJD wrote:I am always going from Celsius and 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35 and 40 are easy to convert with my rule because of the multiplication rules we all learned about 9 and it is easy to divide by 5.

I know the conversions for 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30. 35 and 40F without doing the maths. I just know them. For everything in between, I interpolate, using 1.8F=1C to get me to where I'm going. But I have no similar knowledge of any values below 32F--in other words, what happens when it goes negative C. I have to calculate that every time, and it's a bit trickier. One of many reasons I prefer to avoid being in such temperatures.
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