Marion to plead guilty to doping!


This Forum was created to divert traffic from Current Events at the height of the BALCO scandal. It comes and goes as "needed"; it's back to being locked.

Postby mrbowie » Fri Oct 05, 2007 6:55 pm

Justin Clouder wrote:Not to defend Jones for a microsecond, however the "burn the witch" tone of much of this thread is very unpleasant. She didn't kill anyone.

Nor can this be chalked up as a victory in anti-doping since she has only been outed via an irrelevant (to track) financial fraud, not any efforts by anti-doping authorities.

There are no winners here, there is no good news, only bad news and losers. IMHO.

Justin


Totally disagree.

This is a victory for the good guys, no matter how it came to its sad conclusion.

Young people will now know what happens to somebody that cheats and lies. This is very positive.

Did it matter that Al Capone was sent to prison for tax evasion? The sob was sent to prison because he was a bad guy. Very instructive.

I feel very sad for all of those runners that ran second to Marion Jones. They were the ones that got cheated.
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Postby JRM » Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:18 pm

Mennisco wrote:...It began in '97, when she surged to 10.76 and 21.76 clockings. She never ran faster at sea level in the 200. She improved by 0.06 at sea level in the 100. Am I to believe that she came back and reached what amounted to her career peak [damn close enough to it] in 1997, and only started doping 2 years later? I don't believe it, and anyone who does is living in la-la land.

It is of course possible she was doped without knowing it in '97.


When you blow the cover of a drug addict and start trying to piece things together, they will always fall short of telling you the whole story, while avowing to the death the veracity of their confession. They always keep something up their sleeve.

Be it PEDs or some other hard illicit substance, the motivation is the same. They're doing something they don't want you to find out about, and they want you to leave them alone so they can keep doing it. So, they'll cover it up to the bitter end, even as their world is unraveling around them.
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Postby ozvault » Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:49 pm

What I liked about her press conference was her announcement that she is now retiring from Track and Field!
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Postby cacique » Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:57 pm

there'll be quite some re-arranging in the medals stand, not just in sydney 2000, a quick look at the tables show that she medaled in the 1997 world champs, all the way to the world cup in 2002...
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Postby JRM » Fri Oct 05, 2007 8:23 pm

cacique wrote:there'll be quite some re-arranging in the medals stand, not just in sydney 2000, a quick look at the tables show that she medaled in the 1997 world champs, all the way to the world cup in 2002...


Her admission of guilt only goes back to 1999, so unless I'm missing something, her performances in '97 and '98 can't be stricken.
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Postby 26mi235 » Fri Oct 05, 2007 8:46 pm

jazzcyclist wrote:Kelli White gave the most candid and contrite interview of any doper I've ever seen. I believe that her confession is what actually did her in since, the IAAF didn't actually have the goods to ban her without the confession. She never pretended that she didn't know what she was taking and you actually got the sense that her conscious was tormenting her the whole time she was doping, which probably explains why she didn't dope for very long. With Jones, I get the impression that she only admitted to what was expedient for her legal predicament. I get no sense that she struggled with the decision to dope while she was actually doping.


I seem to recall David Miller doing the confession. I think he said that he actually left the syringes out (and there as investigation into the team in the several days/raiding houses). He said he just did not like the feeling of having won the Worlds (ITT) by cheating. He has done OK since but not great.
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Postby Friar » Fri Oct 05, 2007 8:59 pm

This was from one of her defenders.http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/06/sports/othersports/06rhoden.html?ref=sports
If Jones is serious about redemption, her first order of business should be returning the pieces of gold without being asked. This is harsh, I know, but she should remember that the pursuit of gold tempted her to run a race that she couldn’t win.

I have the feeling Marion is going to have trouble turning in the Gold. Maybe a nebulous statement like 'I've been assured they are in a safe place but I'm not aware of their location', will suffice.
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Postby tjallen » Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:02 pm

She minimized the time period even more in her court plea. She says now she was on the clear ONLY from September 2000 to July 2001.

This will minimize the loss of other medals and money, which the IAAF was threatening to sue for.

tja
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Postby tjallen » Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:04 pm

I've been wondering about this business of drops under the tongue. Yes, nitro for the heart, and a few other meds are given this way, but it is not common at all. Some medicines are dispensed in chewing gum, and coke users do gummers sometimes. But in general, absorption in the mouth is not a common way to give steroids, so far as I've ever heard.

On the other hand, we know the clear came in a syringe, or at least that's the form it was sent by VC to the authorities. I wonder if she was instead injecting under the tongue. I've heard heroin users inject there to hide the tracks (until those vessels collapse), then move on to places like between the toes. Hmmm. Most of the injected steroids I've ever heard of were injected into muscle mass, though, not directly into the bloodstream.

This whole "under the tongue" thing sounds weird, and I wonder if our docs might comment on it.

tja
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Postby Law dude » Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:39 pm

JRM wrote:
cacique wrote:there'll be quite some re-arranging in the medals stand, not just in sydney 2000, a quick look at the tables show that she medaled in the 1997 world champs, all the way to the world cup in 2002...

Her admission of guilt only goes back to 1999, so unless I'm missing something, her performances in '97 and '98 can't be stricken.

Nor can her 1999 performances. The IAAF statute of limitations on admissions is 8 years.
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Postby Law dude » Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:47 pm

malmo wrote:
eldrick wrote:someone kindly tell me why she has admitted to anything ?

Remember she was involved in a whole host of crimes, including the bank fraud thing. The Feds had the responsibility to determine her part in that crime, if any.

My guess she gets a 6 month minimum security gig in the federal pen and probation.

And my guess is that you're in the right ballpark. From what we've all read, it looks as if they had her cold on that check business. That could have been a serious sentence for money laundering, bank fraud, or something similar.

So they scare the shit out of her, offer her a very light fall in return for fessing up to doping and pointing the finger at Graham. I don't even know if she'll do real prison time. In her case, it hardly matters. She's been punished.
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Postby eldrick » Sat Oct 06, 2007 12:12 am

tjallen wrote:I've been wondering about this business of drops under the tongue. Yes, nitro for the heart, and a few other meds are given this way, but it is not common at all. Some medicines are dispensed in chewing gum, and coke users do gummers sometimes. But in general, absorption in the mouth is not a common way to give steroids, so far as I've ever heard.

On the other hand, we know the clear came in a syringe, or at least that's the form it was sent by VC to the authorities. I wonder if she was instead injecting under the tongue. I've heard heroin users inject there to hide the tracks (until those vessels collapse), then move on to places like between the toes. Hmmm. Most of the injected steroids I've ever heard of were injected into muscle mass, though, not directly into the bloodstream.

This whole "under the tongue" thing sounds weird, and I wonder if our docs might comment on it.

tja


plenty of drugs are administered sub-lingually

the rational is that this route by-passes the liver & therefore doesn't get metabolised by it, as soon

some drugs are metabolised 95%+ by the liver when swallowed directly - this route may only get 20 or 30% metabolised

it's in effect to "preserve" the drug in the system
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Postby oldvaulter » Sat Oct 06, 2007 12:20 am

I find myself very discouraged by track becoming a sport where we can't count on the results of an event until after more than eight years. It's easy to understand the logic of changing past results based on new revelations, but it leaves us with a situation in which, after the race is run, we can only say that we know the winner "for now", pending revelations that could come many years hence.

Rewriting the past based on what we come to know later is a potentially endless process which undermines the enjoyment of competition in the present. I'm not suggesting that past results therefore not be changed, only that we're in a situation now that robs us of one of our most fundamental enjoyments of the sport -- the decisiveness of competition, putting it all on the line when the gun goes off, the winner is the one who gets to the finish line first. Losing this is a very big loss.
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Postby mump boy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 12:41 am

if she's admitting to use in 2001 then there are some rather unfortunate medallists !!!

in 100 thanou moves up to silver and MJ training partner gets chandra stirrup gets bronze. thanou has served a ban and it's best i don;t comment on block who won the race but say they are taken out the equation we move to chrste gains in 5 to medal !!!

in the 200 debbie feguson is now WC :D but kelli white moves up to silver (has this already been takena way ??) and latasha jenkins gets bronze !!!!

3 of the top 4 (All USA) are convicted or have admitted drug use !!!
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Postby tjallen » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:35 am

eldrick wrote:
plenty of drugs are administered sub-lingually
the rational is that this route by-passes the liver


Thanks eldrick. It makes some more sense to me now.
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Postby nevetsllim » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:45 am

mump boy wrote:if she's admitting to use in 2001 then there are some rather unfortunate medallists !!!

in 100 thanou moves up to silver and MJ training partner gets chandra stirrup gets bronze. thanou has served a ban and it's best i don;t comment on block who won the race but say they are taken out the equation we move to chrste gains in 5 to medal !!!

in the 200 debbie feguson is now WC :D but kelli white moves up to silver (has this already been takena way ??) and latasha jenkins gets bronze !!!!

3 of the top 4 (All USA) are convicted or have admitted drug use !!!


White has been DSQ'ed anyway. It would mean Cydonie Mothersill would have got the bronze medal.

Also, it would be that Pauline Davis should become double Olympic champion in her fifth Olympics! Bahamas would have a double gold with Ferguson 'winning' in 2001.
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Postby thunder » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:50 am

26mi235 wrote:
jazzcyclist wrote:Kelli White gave the most candid and contrite interview of any doper I've ever seen. I believe that her confession is what actually did her in since, the IAAF didn't actually have the goods to ban her without the confession. She never pretended that she didn't know what she was taking and you actually got the sense that her conscious was tormenting her the whole time she was doping, which probably explains why she didn't dope for very long. With Jones, I get the impression that she only admitted to what was expedient for her legal predicament. I get no sense that she struggled with the decision to dope while she was actually doping.


I seem to recall David Miller doing the confession. I think he said that he actually left the syringes out (and there as investigation into the team in the several days/raiding houses). He said he just did not like the feeling of having won the Worlds (ITT) by cheating. He has done OK since but not great.


Millar did not tell all. He went from beating Armstrong in a Tour tt, in his debut, and winning worlds, to 19th in the worlds tt this year. Vast difference. He won a tt last year in the Vuelta after coming back. I give him benefit of doubt now, because as one of the most talented (doped) tters, there is no way he could ride 19th with artificial aid. (sorry for hijacking)
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Postby Flumpy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:38 am

optimistic wrote:But without those......you're......losing.......me........


Well that's hardly a big loss :roll:
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Postby liuxuan » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:43 am

i just wanna say im so glad that marion didnt cause foina may to gt a lesser medal in 99 or 2000! go fiona, pauline and merlene!
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Postby Matt » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:44 am

liuxuan wrote:i just wanna say im so glad that marion didnt cause foina may to gt a lesser medal in 99 or 2000! go fiona, pauline and merlene!


The irony!
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Postby Flumpy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:47 am

jazzcyclist wrote:Kelli White gave the most candid and contrite interview of any doper I've ever seen. I believe that her confession is what actually did her in since, the IAAF didn't actually have the goods to ban her without the confession. She never pretended that she didn't know what she was taking and you actually got the sense that her conscious was tormenting her the whole time she was doping, which probably explains why she didn't dope for very long. With Jones, I get the impression that she only admitted to what was expedient for her legal predicament. I get no sense that she struggled with the decision to dope while she was actually doping.


Completely agree. I actually have some respect for Kelli (And Dwaine) who confessed to far more than they needed to and blamed nobody but themselves. They seemed genuinely sorry and apologetic when they could very easily have just continued denying everything like most cheats do.

Marion on the other hand has admitted the very minimum having been forced to by the courts. Truly pathetic woman who's sorry arsed coursteps statement made me cringe. Was it just me or did she not actually mention drug use one?

I can't believe some people are feeling sorry for her :roll:
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Postby EPelle » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:50 am

Good afternoon, everyone,

I am Marion Jones-Thompson, and I am here today, because I have something very important to tell you, my fans, my friends and my family.

Over the many years of my life, as an athlete in the sport of track and field, you have been fiercely loyal and supportive towards me. Even more loyal and supportive than words can declare has been my family – and especially my dear mother who stands by my side today.

And so it is with a great amount of shame that I stand before you and tell you that I have betrayed your trust.

I want all of you to know that today I plead guilty to two counts of making false statements to federal agents. Making false statements to these agents was an incredibly stupid thing for me to do, and I am responsible fully for my actions. I have no one to blame but myself for what I have done.

To you, my fans – including my young supporters, the United States Track & Field Association, my closest friends, my attorneys, and the most-classy family a person could ever hope for, namely my mother, my husband, my children, my brother and his family, my uncle, and the rest of my extended family – I want you to know that I have been dishonest. And you have the right to be angry with me. I have let them down, I have let my country down, and I have let myself down.

I recognise that by saying ‘I am deeply sorry’, it might not be enough and sufficient to address the pain and the hurt that I have caused you. Therefore, I want to ask for your forgiveness for my actions, and I hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me.

I have asked Almighty God for my forgiveness.

Having said this, and because of my actions, I am retiring from the sport of track and field – a sport which I deeply love.

I promise that these events will be used to make the lives of many people improved – that by making the wrong choices and bad decisions can be disastrous.

I want to thank you all for your time.

transcribed.
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Postby Flumpy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:58 am

Matt wrote:Only this week I have read dozens of posts from people eulogising a 'great' athlete who was known for years within US track and field circles as having been a steroid user (and for suffering from the ensuing health problems). There are very few 'amazing' performances that are not drug assisted......


Interesting, But in his time they weren't illegal, where they?

When did PED actually become banned?
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Postby Flumpy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:59 am

Matt wrote:The irony!


Irony :?: :?: :?:
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Postby Jaack » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:05 am

Jaack wrote:
At 34, the oldest sprint champion in the history of the sport(?)! Pauline Davis Thompson- What a legend.
Anyone care to verify this?
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Postby SQUACKEE » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:16 am

DrJay wrote:
SQUACKEE wrote:
DrJay wrote:Is mental illness
Are you referring to Matt or Tafnut? :P

Er, uhh...I kinda had you in mind, squack. :wink:


I serve up the Doc a softball and he hits it outta da park.
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Postby EPelle » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:19 am

Next time, Squack, put a fire-cracker in the middle, and see what happens when he swings. :twisted:
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Postby DrJay » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:32 am

SQUACKEE wrote:
DrJay wrote:
SQUACKEE wrote:
DrJay wrote:Is mental illness
Are you referring to Matt or Tafnut? :P

Er, uhh...I kinda had you in mind, squack. :wink:


I serve up the Doc a softball and he hits it outta da park.


I am DrJay, and I am here today, because I have something very important to tell you, my fans, my friends and my family. I used a corked bat.
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Postby MJD » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:35 am

Law dude wrote:The IAAF statute of limitations on admissions is 8 years.



Ridiculous and embarassing.
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Postby SQUACKEE » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:42 am

EPelle wrote:

I have asked Almighty God for my forgiveness.



transcribed.


Ok maybe im nit-picking but it should read im asking God for HIS forgiveness. Narcissistic to the end?
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Postby MJD » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:44 am

Carl Lewis just said on NBC that they have to get these frauds under oath. That is what I always have been saying. The whole Dubin thing. Basically how they got MJ. Now they should put a few of those ridiculous ballplayers in jail that lied under oath to congress. And I swore that I wouldn't go bump crazy but this is funny:

"I don't think much will come of this as I don't think the various levels of US government don't want to see how termite infested the house is(the level of drug usage in all sports)."


http://mb.trackandfieldnews.com/discuss ... ubin#23538
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Postby Powell » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:49 am

Flumpy wrote:
Matt wrote:Only this week I have read dozens of posts from people eulogising a 'great' athlete who was known for years within US track and field circles as having been a steroid user (and for suffering from the ensuing health problems). There are very few 'amazing' performances that are not drug assisted......


Interesting, But in his time they weren't illegal, where they?


Not in 1968, but they were banned long before 1980.
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Postby MattMarriott » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:52 am

How Marion Jones was forced to "confess" - the true story

When it comes to being jailed and being seperated from your daughters, it's easy for the illuminati to stage the total humiliation of the resistors
http://mb.trackandfieldnews.com/discuss ... hp?t=28016
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Postby bad hammy » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:02 am

MJD wrote:
Law dude wrote:The IAAF statute of limitations on admissions is 8 years.

Ridiculous and embarassing.

Last time I checked, around these parts every crime on the books has a statute of limitation (seven years or less) except murder. So you are suggesting that we put PED use on the same level as murder? THAT sounds kind of ridiculous . . .

(And didn't you recently find a spell checker in your browser? Not using it can be kind of 'embarassing'. :P )
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Postby SQUACKEE » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:03 am

MattMarriott wrote:How Marion Jones was forced to "confess" - the true story

[b]When it comes to being insane and being seperated from [b]reality[/], it's easy for the illuminati to take total control of the deranged.
http://mb.trackandfieldnews.com/discuss ... hp?t=28016
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Postby MJD » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:09 am

bad hammy wrote:Last time I checked, around these parts every crime on the books has a statute of limitation (seven years or less) except murder. So you are suggesting that we put PED use on the same level as murder? THAT sounds kind of ridiculous



Ask that Cuban who showed some poster around here his minor medal from 50 years earlier what he would think about the issue.
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Postby Littlemac » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:14 am

Jaack wrote:Pauline Davis Thompson is the Olympic champion!!!

She arrived at Sydney at the age of 34, dropping from the 400m to the 200m - she took. 2 off her PB of 8 years, then another to place second in the final BEHIND MJ!

At 34, the oldest sprint champion in the history of the sport(?)! Pauline Davis Thompson- What a legend.


No, I don't think so.
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Postby tandfman » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:19 am

MattMarriott wrote:How Marion Jones was forced to "confess" - the true story

When it comes to being jailed and being seperated from your daughters, it's easy for the illuminati to stage the total humiliation of the resistors
http://mb.trackandfieldnews.com/discuss ... hp?t=28016

Tell us more about Tim Montgomery, Jr.'s sex change. We hadn't heard about this. :P
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Postby jazzcyclist » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:21 am

What'll be interesting is the first interview she does? Will she admit just the bare minimum a la Pete Rose or will she tell all a la Jose Canseco? Remember, Canseco says that he would have never made it to the Majors without PED's, not to mention become an MVP. Rose, on the other hand, initially denied betting at all. Then he admitted betting on sports other than baseball. Later on he admitted betting on baseball, but not Reds games. Then he admitted betting on Reds games but never against the Reds, which still contradicts the facts and evidence contained in the Dowd report.
Last edited by jazzcyclist on Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tandfman » Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:23 am

never mind
Last edited by tandfman on Sat Oct 06, 2007 4:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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