Suggestions for a fix


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Suggestions for a fix

Postby Zat0pek » Thu Oct 23, 2003 7:59 am

Everyone laments the cheats, but no one talks about how to stop it. The problem is that the cheaters are (almost) always ahead of the testers. I would like to start a CONSTRUCTIVE thread about how to fix this situation and restore credibility to the sport. Here is what I propose:

1. Pick a date to start over. All records will be wiped out and start anew. Allow a one-year transition period before beginning to keep new records.

2. After that date, increase the amount of testing both in and out of competition. But here's the key: KEEP THE SAMPLES FROZEN FOR A PERIOD OF TIME (say, 10-15 years).

3. As new tests are developed, retest old samples.

4. Any positive, including a positive resulting from a new test on an old sample, results in that athlete suffering the following consequences:
A. All records and medals in championship competition are stipped from the athlete from a period two years before the sample through the remainder of the athletes career.
B. All prize money is ordered refunded to the athletes finishing behind that runner.
C. Lifetime ban.

Anyone else have any suggestions?
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby rmayes » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:10 am

How long do they keep the current samples? I wonder if we need to start completely over or if we can just go back and test all the old samples we already have. Someone mentioned that old samples are kept somewhere in Canada I believe, any idea how far back they go?
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Guest » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:25 am

I pray that they go back to at least 1996...Man some people got away with murder at that meet in
Atlanta....And I want their dirty names revealed before I leave this earth!!!!!!
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Powell » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:27 am

Why not just punish drug use by public crucifixion. Not only would this dramatically cut drug use in T&F, it would also provide some free entertainment to the masses.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Zat0pek » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:33 am

I don't see starting over with records any differntly than what happens when a new javelin is introduced. Old records and results stand as just that - old records and results. You just start over with the new rules.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Guest » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:36 am

Some good ideas. An important question: How long can samples realistically be stored and still remain viable for testing? Also, after a while, you'd run out of sufficient volume for testing, wouldn't you?

I understand the outrage and desire to clean up the sport, but personally I believe that the sport is cleaner now than 20 years ago. Testing is actually catching people! There wouldn't be as much of an outcry, let's face it, if people were still getting away with everything.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Zat0pek » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:39 am

When I was in college, I worked in the vet school lab one summer. We had an absolute-zero freezer for keeping various fluid samples (blood, amniotic fluid, urine) for long-term research. I won't say they can be frozen indefinitely, but they can be frozen for a very long time under the right conditions.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Asterix » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:54 am

Someone mentioned that old
>samples are kept somewhere in Canada I believe,
>any idea how far back they go?

Up highway 11, in the frozen tundra north of Barrie, they have acres and acres of unheated tents set up with thousands of shelves of frozen urine from athletes all over the world, in many sports, going back at least 20 years. These are just down the road from the abandoned nickel mine the US government leases to store DNA samples on every American who has ever handled currency.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby MJD » Thu Oct 23, 2003 9:15 am

>Up highway 11, in the frozen
>tundra north of Barrie, they have acres and acres
>of unheated tents set up with thousands of
>shelves of frozen urine from athletes all over
>the world, in many sports, going back at least 20
>years. These are just down the road from the
>abandoned nickel mine the US government leases to
>store DNA samples on every American who has ever
>handled currency.

That mine also has a copy of every single telephone conversation and email since the invention of both but I think he was referring to this:

"Thousands of urine samples dating back several years are frozen at the Olympic-approved Montreal lab."

http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/sto ... ry/Sports/
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby gh » Thu Oct 23, 2003 9:21 am

At this point there was an inappropriate post that was yanked. So was the next one, by ZatOpek, only because they were linked and the software had no choice. Sorry Z, but here's what you said:

<<Does any know if or for how long they keep samples now? I was under the impression it was pretty short - a year or two or until any time for appeals, etc. had run.

Anybody know for sure?>>>
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Guest » Thu Oct 23, 2003 9:27 am

Ugh. This whole issue is so tiresome. I'm all in favor of staying in the "sports" business, and have no interest at all in the long-term urine storage business. There may well be partial "fixes" out there, but the chances of genuine, across-the board fixes?--approximately nil.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby MJD » Thu Oct 23, 2003 9:32 am

>Ugh. This whole issue is so tiresome. I'm all
>in favor of staying in the "sports" business,
>and have no interest at all in the long-term
>urine storage business. There may well be
>partial "fixes" out there, but the chances of
>genuine, across-the board fixes?--approximately
>nil.

I get the impression that they don't necessarily want to get anyone with the retesting(probably can't) but, rather, find out how long the stuff has been kicking around.
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Re: Suggestions for a fix

Postby Zat0pek » Thu Oct 23, 2003 9:34 am

No problem, Garry. What are your thoughts on a fix?
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