Future Hurdlers


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Future Hurdlers

Postby harvtrack » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:41 am

When one looks at the current high school list for the boy's high hurdles the future looks exceedingly bright. Tony Brown (Beaumont, TX) and Marlon Humphrey (Hoover, AL) have both run 13.38 while a step back on the list is Devon Allen (Phoenix, AZ) at 13.48. Not only are these three exceptional hurdlers, but they are also exceedingly good football players. Brown and Humphrey are incoming seniors and are being recruited VERY HEAVILY for their football prowess. Allen is headed to Oregon for football this fall. 2012 leader Artie Burns (13.35) is headed to Miami as a footballer. All four have expressed interest in running in college, but we all know how that goes. I guess I can’t help but wonder if any of these talented four will ever score at NC’s.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Marlow » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:45 am

harvtrack wrote:When one looks at the current high school list for the boy's high hurdles the future looks exceedingly bright. . . . they are also exceedingly good football players.

Unfortunately, you just contradicted yourself. :(
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:48 am

I keep hoping that Jeff Demps starts a new trend of athletes keeping their track careers going while playing in the NFL. You that what Demps is doing has to interest quite a few football players who would love to compete in the Olympics.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby cladthin » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:59 am

With all that great talent, since they are going to schools with football as a first choice (program providing the scholarship) you do have to question in some cases do they ever run and for those that do, how well can they run committing most of their time/energy/efforts to football? With Oregon I don't doubt that Allen will give it a go with, I think, their entire 4 x 1 this year being fb players but how effective can he or others be? Regarding Burns, does Golden have an history with this sort of thing? Has he had other two sport athletes that he allowed to do both? I don't know. My guess is if Humphrey goes to Alabama, his track days are probably over. If Brown goes to Texas then you can see him continuing on as they have definitely had those guys over the years under Mack and before.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:12 am

cladthin wrote: My guess is if Humphrey goes to Alabama, his track days are probably over.

Why would you think that? After all, Nick Saban recruited Bennie Brazell, Xavier Carter and Trindon Holliday and I seem to recall them having pretty decent collegiate track careers. I doubt that Saban would have taken Pat Henry on recruiting trips with him if he had a negative attitude towards two-sport athletes.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Grasshopper » Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:26 am

The muscle-mass that college football programs will require these kids to put on is much friendlier to short-sprinters than it is to high hurdlers. The majority of successful high hurdlers don't have football bodies. David Oliver is an exception to the norm.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby valleyrunner » Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:38 am

Nick Saban left LSU at the end of the 2004 football season so he never coached football when Xavier Carter was running track at LSU in 05 and 06. Same with Trindan Holliday. Brazell had limited track time. If Humphrey is serious about track he will not attend Bama but thats a personal question and all the football crazed people around him in Alabama may influence his choice and that will be that for his track career.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby cladthin » Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:55 am

jazzcyclist wrote:
cladthin wrote: My guess is if Humphrey goes to Alabama, his track days are probably over.

Why would you think that? After all, Nick Saban recruited Bennie Brazell, Xavier Carter and Trindon Holliday and I seem to recall them having pretty decent collegiate track careers. I doubt that Saban would have taken Pat Henry on recruiting trips with him if he had a negative attitude towards two-sport athletes.


I see Saban as being so demanding of the player's time, attention, focus that I cannot see him giving that control up to another sport. Have their been any Alabama examples of fb/track athletes?
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:12 am

valleyrunner wrote:Nick Saban left LSU at the end of the 2004 football season so he never coached football when Xavier Carter was running track at LSU in 05 and 06. Same with Trindan Holliday. Brazell had limited track time. If Humphrey is serious about track he will not attend Bama but thats a personal question and all the football crazed people around him in Alabama may influence his choice and that will be that for his track career.

You don't know what you're talking about. First of all, Brazell ran track all four years at LSU, including three (2002-2004) when Saban was still there, and not only did he make the NCAA final in the 400 hurdles all four years, but in his freshman and sophomore years, he anchored LSU to 4x100 meter relay titles. As a matter of fact, in 2004, Saban allowed Brazell to miss all of spring training to improve his chances of making the Olympic team, and not only did he make the team, but he made it all the way to the Olympic final. Does that sound like he had "limited track time" to you?

Secondly, Saban recruited all three of them, and that's my main point. Why would a coach recruit dual-sport athletes if he had a negative attitude about such athletes? Why would he bring a track coach on recruiting trips if he felt that way? I remember when Saban was asked about his philosophy about such athletes, he said, "Either you can allow them to play football and run track for LSU or they're going to play football and run track somewhere else." Now perhaps Saban's attitude has changed since he went to Alabama, but there's nothing in his history to suggest he feels this way.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby 26mi235 » Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:43 am

In the 'future hurdler' category certain the USATF Athlete of the Week deserves mention. Tia Jones (13) ran the 200h in 25.34 and the 100h in 13.53 in a 9-race meet [100h/200h/200] and placed high in the 200 at just under 24 with a wind-legal 24.02. That 200h mark was stunning and was run when she was fresh in the prelims.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Marlow » Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:51 am

26mi235 wrote:In the 'future hurdler' category [she] deserves mention. Tia Jones, age 13, ran the 200H in 25.34

She is quite the age-group phenom.
As you see in this video, she looks and runs like a 17-year-old.

http://www.runnerspace.com/video.php?video_id=98368
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:58 am

26mi235 wrote:In the 'future hurdler' category certain the USATF Athlete of the Week deserves mention. Tia Jones (13) ran the 200h in 25.34 and the 100h in 13.53 in a 9-race meet [100h/200h/200] and placed high in the 200 at just under 24 with a wind-legal 24.02. That 200h mark was stunning and was run when she was fresh in the prelims.

Actually, she's only 12 and doesn't make 13 until later this year. She still has another five years to go before some school can get her signature of the dotted line. It will be interesting to how she developes physically.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:02 am

cladthin wrote:Have their been any Alabama examples of fb/track athletes?

The fact that Alabama isn't considered a top tier track school isn't helping Saban with these types of athletes. I read that Tony Brown is high on Saban, but he was very underwhelmed by Alabama's track program when he and his sister Bealoved went to Tuscaloosa for a recruiting visit.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby cladthin » Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:00 pm

jazzcyclist wrote:
cladthin wrote:Have their been any Alabama examples of fb/track athletes?

The fact that Alabama isn't considered a top tier track school isn't helping Saban with these types of athletes. I read that Tony Brown is high on Saban, but he was very underwhelmed by Alabama's track program when he and his sister Bealoved went to Tuscaloosa for a recruiting visit.


So none or even just a few? With the level of athlete they can bring in that can win three cfb ncs over the last four years (and he's entering into his 7th season as the hc) I would expect someone would have been a top level athlete in track as well during that time.

While I don't know of any hurdlers at UA, they did have Diondre Batson this year and the coach did have a lot of sprint and hurdle success at OU with Salaam and Ash. Before that he had Ryan Braitwaite, Tabarie Henry and Alonso Edward while at Barton. If there is a problem perhaps scholarship allocation on the part of the head coach but the asst. coach does have a good history with sprinters and hurdlers.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby valleyrunner » Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:58 pm

Bama has had none under Saban run track for more than 3 weeks. Some have been recruited with ok to run but then are discouraged and made to feel like they are not doing what they need to be doing to make Bama (Saban) football great and so it has worsened.

Saban recruits speed guys with idea, sure let them run a little but knows he will get them to choose not to run track once on campus. Its a culture he has developed especially now at Bama. He has become even more of a control freak. Ask Harvey Glance before he departed Bama what it was like. I have and Saban is no fan of track I can assure you.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby jazzcyclist » Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:26 pm

Perhaps you're right. Maybe his attitude towards dual-sport athletes has changed since he went to Alabama, but I can assure you that it wasn't like that at LSU. A few years ago, I was having a conversation with some S.I.D.'s at the NCAA championships when this topic came up, and at that time, the general consensus was that Mack Brown, Urban Meyer and Nick Saban were the three most track-friendly football coaches in the nation. But if that's Saban's attitutde now, he can forget about signing Tony Brown, since he's committed to running track in college. In this respect, the worst coach who's ever come through LSU was Gerry Dinardo, who once had a pissing contest with Pat Henry that played out in a series of back and forth interviews in the newspaper and on sports talk radio.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby harvtrack » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:56 am

A recent article that appeared in a Louisiana newspaper (http://s.nola.com/alwkb3W) entitled "2016 Olympics Weighing Heavily On The Mind Of LSU CB Target Tony Brown" is a pretty interesting read. Apparently Brown hopes to graduate after the current football season and enroll in January at either LSU, Texas A&M, Florida State, or Alabama. Sounds like he hopes to be able to run track for his chosen school next spring. I know more footballers are graduating early in order to participate in spring practice, but are there any examples of kids who have competed early in track? I also wonder how this will go over with the football coaches.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gm » Thu Sep 19, 2013 6:56 pm

harvtrack wrote: I know more footballers are graduating early in order to participate in spring practice, but are there any examples of kids who have competed early in track?


There was this one dude, you probably didn't hear about him...well, maybe just a little...OK, you probably did... 400m hurdler Robert Griffin of Copperas Cove? :D
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby notlef70 » Fri Sep 20, 2013 10:11 am

gm wrote:
harvtrack wrote: I know more footballers are graduating early in order to participate in spring practice, but are there any examples of kids who have competed early in track?


There was this one dude, you probably didn't hear about him...well, maybe just a little...OK, you probably did... 400m hurdler Robert Griffin of Copperas Cove? :D


Oh. Him.. That Redskin dude... :lol:
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Smoke » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:50 pm

History says we have not identified the future star yet. These guys are football players, and that dramatically lessens their future. However, Brown has mentioned he plans to run until he makes the Olympic team. That I like a lot
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby DentyCracker » Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:56 pm

Funny enough the kid that beat Humphrey in the 110h at WYC also plays football. Association football that is. He is the son of a Jamaican football legend Lenny "Teacher" Hyde, now a football coach. He is a star striker for his high school and turned down a spot on the U-17 National team to train for the WYC, as his first love is track and field.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Bruce Kritzler » Sat Sep 21, 2013 8:05 pm

Grasshopper wrote:The muscle-mass that college football programs will require these kids to put on is much friendlier to short-sprinters than it is to high hurdlers. The majority of successful high hurdlers don't have football bodies. David Oliver is an exception to the norm.


Jamal Charles found he couldn't get his lead leg over the HH after 6mo. of football weight room.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby 18.99s » Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:10 am

jazzcyclist wrote:Actually, she's only 12 and doesn't make 13 until later this year.

12 at the time of that race, turned 13 on September 8. But she looks and hurdles like 20.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby lonewolf » Sun Sep 22, 2013 12:32 pm

This girl is 12 years old??? :shock:
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Marlow » Sun Sep 22, 2013 12:54 pm

lonewolf wrote:This girl is 12 years old??? :shock:

Well, there's pre-pub 12 and post-pub 12; she looks older.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby 26mi235 » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:41 am

25-low is pretty good for a 12-year old; doing it over the hurdles shows technique not typical of someone that young. And being strong enough to carry it through to the end without flagging indicates that she might soon be able to hit some good 300h marks when she gets to that distance. Of course, she is excellent over the 100h as well. How do the hurdle heights change from the 12-13 age group?
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Marlow » Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:15 am

26mi235 wrote:How do the hurdle heights change from the 12-13 age group?

11-12 and 13-14 are 30"
15-16 and 17-18 are 33"
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby houstonian » Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:42 pm

For hurdling football players, the probability of hurdling success has very much to do with the historic two sport model at a given school, than it does about the relative promise of the hurdler. Example: football players at Notre Dame, Alabama, Nebraska or Penn State have historically never been allowed to run track because of institutional policies installed by iconic football coaches at those schools.

If the athlete attends a university where football players may truly participate in track, those guys will have an opportunity to be very successful. Physically, great hurdlers have "great hips" which transfer well into the movement skills required of defensive backs and wide receivers -- making hurdles the perfect developmental activity for elite football athletes. Some football coaches actually understand this and create a recruiting advantage for themselves by "sharing" their prized recruits with the track coach.

Every 5-8 years, a hurdler of consequence emerges from the gridiron:
(*= NCAA Champion)
Bobby Moore* (Ahmad Rashad) - Oregon
Earl McCullough* - USC
Willie Gault* - Tennessee
Thomas Wilcher - Michigan
Charles Woodson - Purdue
Qadry Ishmael - Syracuse
Reggie Torian* - began as a football player at Wisconsin
Jabari Greer* - Tennessee
Jamaal Charles - sprinted , but never hurdled at Texas
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gh » Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:57 pm

houstonian wrote:....
Every 5-8 years, a hurdler of consequence emerges from the gridiron:
(*= NCAA Champion)
Bobby Moore* (Ahmad Rashad) - Oregon...


You're confusing him with Bouncy Moore, the long jumper who followed him at Oregon by 3-4 years.

Bobby Moore was Washington State high jump champ as a prep (about 6-6), but not sure he ever competed for Oregon in track. Certainly not with any great distinction.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby no one » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:29 pm

Richmond (?)
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby houstonian » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:07 pm

you are wrong my friend. Booby Moore is (was) NCAA 120 yard hurdle champ for the U of Oregon (1963 I believe), changed his name, became Vikings star receiver, married to Felecia Rashad, became a tv analyst..
I know perfectly well who Bouncy Moore is -- contemporary of Ralph Boston. No relation to Bobby Moore/ Ahmad Rashad
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gm » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:34 pm

houstonian wrote:you are wrong my friend. Booby Moore is (was) NCAA 120 yard hurdle champ for the U of Oregon (1963 I believe), changed his name, became Vikings star receiver, married to Felecia Rashad, became a tv analyst..


Uhhh, no. Absolutely incorrect. Wrong. Not right. False.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby Run and Jump » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:04 pm

I believe it is Rod Woodson, not Charles in the list above.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gh » Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:16 am

houstonian wrote:you are wrong my friend. Booby Moore is (was) NCAA 120 yard hurdle champ for the U of Oregon (1963 I believe), changed his name, became Vikings star receiver, married to Felecia Rashad, became a tv analyst..
I know perfectly well who Bouncy Moore is -- contemporary of Ralph Boston. No relation to Bobby Moore/ Ahmad Rashad


as gm notes, very wrong.

Bobby Moore didn't graduate from high school until '67.

The only Moore who ever made an NCAA high hurdle final was Cal's Tom Moore in 1935. (no Rashad—or Ahmad for that matter—has ever made the final)

Bouncy Moore (born 1951) and Ralph Boston (born 1939) weren't quite contemporaries, although Boston's long career almost made it so. Boston last made the U.S. Rankings in '68, Moore's first appearance wasn't until '70.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby mt » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:17 am

houstonian wrote:you are wrong my friend. Booby Moore is (was) NCAA 120 yard hurdle champ for the U of Oregon (1963 I believe), changed his name, became Vikings star receiver, married to Felecia Rashad, became a tv analyst..
I know perfectly well who Bouncy Moore is -- contemporary of Ralph Boston. No relation to Bobby Moore/ Ahmad Rashad


Quite possibly, you have confused Moore with Mel Renfro, who was second in the 1962 NCAA meet, to Oregon teammate Jerry Tarr and is in the pro football hall of fame.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby houstonian » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:09 am

thank you. Renfro it is!
Booby MAY of Rice won the NCAA in 1964 (not a football player).
and how could I leave Tennessee's Richmond Flowers off the list. duh.

-
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gh » Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:39 pm

if you ever have any doubt about NCAA finalists: http://www.trackandfieldnews.com/index. ... mpionships
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby wamego relays champ » Sat Oct 12, 2013 8:06 am

gh wrote:
Bouncy Moore (born 1951) and Ralph Boston (born 1939) weren't quite contemporaries, although Boston's long career almost made it so. Boston last made the U.S. Rankings in '68, Moore's first appearance wasn't until '70.


For me Bouncy Moore and Ralph Boston are linked, but not from competing together. My memory is of the CBS telecasts of T&F in the early 70's with Boston doing field event commentary, during which an attempt by Bouncy would be described by Ralph as a "Gooooood jump!"

.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby gktrack » Wed Feb 05, 2014 8:53 pm

Looks like both 2013's HS co-leaders in the 110H (Marlon Humphrey and Tony Brown, 13.38 as juniors), both 5-star recruited cornerbacks, are going to Alabama.

Also looks like Tony Brown enrolled early at 'Bama, and has already run his first indoor 42" hurdle race for the Tide ...
http://www.rolltide.com/sports/c-xctrack/mtt/tony_brown_ii_881264.html

Hope to see both of them with successful football and track careers at 'Bama.
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Re: Future Hurdlers

Postby KDFINE » Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:43 pm

GH. The list of NCAA high hurdler finalists correctly lists renaissance man Bernie Casey in 1960, but gives his school as Miami of Ohio. It was Bowling Green.
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