¶USATF Dec: Ashton Eaton 8291


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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:59 pm

I figured that he had an excellent chance. The two guys from Wisconsin (Cato and Zeimek) had pretty decent HJ (2.03, 2.06) and lost ~250 points. I am not sure how we Drouin does in the PV, I think he is a decent hurdler (vague memory) and should be Heptathlon-decent in the 1000. Both UW guys have gone 5.15 this year and Cato took some attempts at 5.30 last week. Cato is substantially better than Zeimek in the 60H and then they get to gut it out. Cato had a pretty good LJ day, going 7.70 in the Hept and 7.85/25-9.25 in the open (on two jumps).
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Re: USA Multis--Jeremy Taiwo

Postby olorin » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:05 pm

26mi235 wrote:Jay Cato went out at 5.30 today at the Wisconsin meet; he was clean until then but had already gone 7.5x in the LJ and 7.0x in the 60.

Even without Beach (I think he is out) there are a number of strong contenders for the Hept at NCAAs (and the women's Pent as well).

Cato improved his PB in the LJ to 7.70 at big 10 indoor.

Garrett Scantling (19) from Georgia is showing that he has a potential to be a world class decathlete.
In the SEC indoor he set three PBs in the first day including:
60 - 6.95 (previous PB 7.10)
LJ - 7.14 (previous PB 7.01)
SP - 14.26 (previous PB 13.39). :shock:
He is faster than Cato and Beach over the 60 and much (much) better thrower. He is also three years younger. Hope they have good coaches in Georgia that will ensure that he fulfil his potential.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Dave » Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:10 am

It is very encouraging to have this kind of material to discuss without any real mention of Eaton, Hardee's, or Clay. Did Clay retire after the Olympic trials?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:39 am

Dave wrote:It is very encouraging to have this kind of material to discuss without any real mention of Eaton, Hardee's, or Clay. Did Clay retire after the Olympic trials?


I was assuming that Clay had retired but I don't remember him announcing it officially.

The field so far for the USATF heptathlon, from Frank Zarnowski's DECA site:

Trey Hardee, Miller Moss, Jake Arnold, Curtis Beach, Gunnar Nixon, Ryan Harlan, Dan Gooris, Corbin Duer, Terry Prentice

Ashton Eaton had announced some time ago that he would not compete indoors.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Dave » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:05 am

unclezadok wrote:
Dave wrote:It is very encouraging to have this kind of material to discuss without any real mention of Eaton, Hardee's, or Clay. Did Clay retire after the Olympic trials?


I was assuming that Clay had retired but I don't remember him announcing it officially.

The field so far for the USATF heptathlon, from Frank Zarnowski's DECA site:

Trey Hardee, Miller Moss, Jake Arnold, Curtis Beach, Gunnar Nixon, Ryan Harlan, Dan Gooris, Corbin Duer, Terry Prentice

Ashton Eaton had announced some time ago that he would not compete indoors.

Too bad Eaton isn't competing indoors. It is fun to watch him play to his strength.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:00 pm

Storming finish for Cato:

1 Cato, Japheth 7.03 7.70m 11.99m 2.03m 7.83 5.15m 2:45.42
Wisconsin 25-03.25 39-04 6-08 16-10.75
Team Points: 10 6090 (872) (985) (606) (831) 3294 (1025) (957) (814)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Ziemek, Zach 7.04 6.99m 13.11m 2.06m 8.36 5.15m 2:48.25
Wisconsin 22-11.25 43-00.25 6-09 16-10.75
Team Points: 8 5846 (868) (811) (674) (859) 3212 (893) (957) (784)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Drouin, Derek 7.25 7.20m 12.04m 2.30m 8.00 4.15m 2:45.06
Indiana 23-07.5 39-06 7-06.5 13-07.25
Team Points: 6 5817 (796) (862) (609) (1091) 3358 (982) (659) (818)
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:08 pm

I think that Cato, 6090, is only the second collegian to go over 6000 three times (although NCAAs gives others a chance -- it also gives him a chance to hit a fourth. Cato gave up 260 points in the HJ while jumping 203 but his one meter advantage in the PV was worth a 300 swing and he had bests in four events [60 7.03, LJ 7.70 (7.85 in the open competition), 60H 7.83 , PV 515]. Pretty deep for a conference meet -- 5333 did not even score.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Fortius19 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:31 pm

Wow! Nice results from Drouin! That's a very good 1000m time for a HJer.

Glad he was able to finish the competition well on day two to secure his Hept "WR".
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Re: USA Multis--Jeremy Taiwo

Postby olorin » Sat Feb 23, 2013 10:34 pm

olorin wrote:Garrett Scantling (19) from Georgia is showing that he has a potential to be a world class decathlete.
In the SEC indoor he set three PBs in the first day including:
60 - 6.95 (previous PB 7.10)
LJ - 7.14 (previous PB 7.01)
SP - 14.26 (previous PB 13.39). :shock:
He is faster than Cato and Beach over the 60 and much (much) better thrower. He is also three years younger. Hope they have good coaches in Georgia that will ensure that he fulfil his potential.

Scantilng finish with a huge PB of 5889 (old PB 5619)
His last day includes:
60h 8.15 (old PB 8.27)
PV - 4.90 (=PB)
1000 - 2:40.41 (3:00.41)
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:43 pm

2 Ziemek, Zach Wisconsin, 5846, is a sophomore, so he is a bout the same age and Cato (6090) is only a junior, so the age differences are probably not great. Ziemek increased his PR by about the same amount (5598 to 5846, so 248 increases vs 270).

For the Cato comparison, too much difference between 6.95 and 7.01, and Cato has 'quick feet' with a 7.83 60h and a 7.85m LJ. The throws were not that different before (PRs 13.39 vs 13.12 but were a big difference in the results today, although the gradient is rather flat in the shot so the point difference was not that large.

It should be a pretty good NCAA Hept.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:57 am

26mi235 wrote:
For the Cato comparison, too much difference between 6.95 and 7.01, and Cato has 'quick feet' with a 7.83 60h and a 7.85m LJ. The throws were not that different before (PRs 13.39 vs 13.12 but were a big difference in the results today, although the gradient is rather flat in the shot so the point difference was not that large.

It should be a pretty good NCAA Hept.


Cato is two and a half years older than Scantling.
Two years ago Cato had a PB of 5,742 which is ~150 points less than Scantling.

Note, that throughout the discussion I am concentrating on decathlon and NOT on indoor heptathlon. In order to be a force in the decathlon Cato needs to show us that he can improve his throws without deteriorating in other events. As decfan mention this is not an easy feast. Currently, Cato PBs are: 13.12 (i), 31.05, 44.51
So far this year he has not shown any improvement in the SP (11.99! this weekend).
With these set of marks (like Beach) he doesn’t have a chance to be a force in the decathlon. To illustrate, even if (and that’s a very big if) he will score in all non-throwing events the same as Eaton did in the Olympic games he will still end up with ~8,250. Good, but not world class.

Scantling, on the other hand has PBs of:
14.26(i), 39.01, 58.23
These marks are more than 430 points better than Cato. Unlike Cato he showed a large improvement this year in his SP so his DT is likely to improve as well. In the other seven events he is probably in the same level (or slightly better) than Cato was two years ago. Objectively, which one do you think has more potential to become world class (8,500+) at this stage?

I have nothing against Cato or in favour of Scantling. I would be happy with the success of either of them (or any other young decathlete). But until Cato will show us he can throw ~14, ~40, ~55 he will not be a threat to the top American decathlists.
Last edited by olorin on Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:03 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: USA Multis--Jeremy Taiwo

Postby DecFan » Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:58 am

olorin wrote:Scantilng finish with a huge PB of 5889 (old PB 5619)
His last day includes:
60h 8.15 (old PB 8.27)
PV - 4.90 (=PB)
1000 - 2:40.41 (3:00.41)


Note that our own Marlow coached him in HS.
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Re: USA Multis--Jeremy Taiwo

Postby Marlow » Sun Feb 24, 2013 7:39 am

DecFan wrote:our own Marlow coached him in HS.

The scariest thing is that at 6'3, 200 lbs, he still looks SKINNY. He's an athletic savant that can do whatever you show him, and he's only gonna get bigger, faster, stronger. The other irony is that when he was in 7th grade, even though I could see the potential, the girls could beat him in every event. His parents think I am in some way responsible for any of his success but all I did was drag him out to the track, point him down runways, and unleash him on he world! :D
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Re: USA Multis

Postby az2004 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:20 am

suspect eaton has moscow on his mind

no world indoors shapes his schedule a bit

as i posted in a thread, zelinka is with rovelto

interesting to see how she fairs
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:35 am

There has never been any question that Cato has to improve in the throws to be more than a pretty good college decathlete and very good college heptathlete. I would guess his size is about the same as Scantiling. By the way, what were Eaton's throws back as a college junior?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Dave » Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:12 am

unclezadok wrote:Storming finish for Cato:

1 Cato, Japheth 7.03 7.70m 11.99m 2.03m 7.83 5.15m 2:45.42
Wisconsin 25-03.25 39-04 6-08 16-10.75
Team Points: 10 6090 (872) (985) (606) (831) 3294 (1025) (957) (814)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Ziemek, Zach 7.04 6.99m 13.11m 2.06m 8.36 5.15m 2:48.25
Wisconsin 22-11.25 43-00.25 6-09 16-10.75
Team Points: 8 5846 (868) (811) (674) (859) 3212 (893) (957) (784)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Drouin, Derek 7.25 7.20m 12.04m 2.30m 8.00 4.15m 2:45.06
Indiana 23-07.5 39-06 7-06.5 13-07.25
Team Points: 6 5817 (796) (862) (609) (1091) 3358 (982) (659) (818)


So. Lets say mr. Drouin adds 30-40cm in the pv and LJ,do we have a world class contender? Is this comparable to his HJ?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 12:13 pm

I think that there is little chance for him to win an Olympic medal in the decathlon. He is ok in the shot and reasonably fast but not Eaton-like there, and the other throws are going to be a pretty big problem. There is probably too much competition for him to do the Hept at NCAAs (I could be wrong) unless they know he can vault 4.75 but just had an off day.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Sun Feb 24, 2013 6:21 pm

26mi235 wrote: By the way, what were Eaton's throws back as a college junior?

In 2009 (age 21) - 12.63, 41.79, 53.70
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 7:30 pm

How about the year before (i.e., his junior year); for comparison with Marlow's guy, go back to sophomore year as well.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:19 am

With the overall poor standard in the US indoor the multi events are surprisingly deep. The wonder boy (Eaton) is taking the winter off (hopefully to improve his HJ and JT) but there are few interesting athletes to watch both in the men and women side.

Trey Hardee (PB: 6208)
Overall - the best decathletes in the field is also the favourite to win. Although not as good in the heptathlon he should cruise to victory. Likely to win 3-5 of the individual events (60, 60h, LJ, PV, SP).
This year - solid with 7.90 60h (PB 6.70) and 5.20 PV (PB 5.30).
Signal for the summer - if Hardee came to compete and not only to collect another title then he is well capable of 6,400. If he wants to send Eaton a signal then (giving the altitude) he should score 6500.

Curtis Beach (PB 6138)
Unlike Hardee much better in the heptathlon than the decathlon. Brilliant in one event (1000) good to average in other five events and horrible in the SP (12.80). Must improve if he wants to stay ahead of the next NCAA crop.
This year - still below par: 8.60 60h (8.15), 12.33 SP (12.80), 4.60 PV (4.90)
Signal for the summer - An improvement in the SP (13.20+) will be extremely positive signal. Alternatively, a sub 6.90 in the 60 (PB 7.03) will suggest that he improved his speed

Gunner Nixon (PB 6022)
the most exiting young talent that compete in NM. He is only 20 and already above 6,000 points, very good high jumper (2.15). If healthy can be the dark horse of this event.
This year - did not compete
Signal for the summer - An improvement in the 60h (8.09) and PV (4.70) will show that he is not only fast and strong but can also deal with the technical events.

Miller Moss (5986)
Another athlete that need a breakthrough. Likely to finish second to Hardee in both the 60 (6.91) & 60h (7.94). Relatively weak in the jumps. Need to be at his best in order to be on the podium.
This year - Poor LJ (7.05) and relatively good 60h (8.07)
Signal for the summer - a big improvement in the LJ (current PB 7.31).

The rest - Harlan and Arnold seems to be past their best and unlikely to finish in the top three. Murphy is likely to be the best of the rest but will need a large improvement in the SP (12.97) and HJ (1.90) to be competitive. Others are too far away to be consider as contenders.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby decafan » Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:42 am

olorin wrote: Note, that throughout the discussion I am concentrating on decathlon and NOT on indoor heptathlon. In order to be a force in the decathlon Cato needs to show us that he can improve his throws without deteriorating in other events. As decfan mention this is not an easy feast. Currently, Cato PBs are: 13.12 (i), 31.05, 44.51
So far this year he has not shown any improvement in the SP (11.99! this weekend).
With these set of marks (like Beach) he doesn’t have a chance to be a force in the decathlon. To illustrate, even if (and that’s a very big if) he will score in all non-throwing events the same as Eaton did in the Olympic games he will still end up with ~8,250. Good, but not world class.


Two problems with this post. First; not only is it easy to improve the throws at this point in Cato's development, it is fully expected. The shocking thing would be if he didn't improve. Don't base his lack of improvement on one meet. He threw worse than that at Indoor NCAA's last year. Young decathletes can be very inconsistent in the shot. Throws are very technical in nature. Young decathletes don't need to add much strength or muscle mass to improve their throws. Technically, most are very poor. Technical improvements alone will suffice for significant improvement.
Second; What do you mean a score of 8250 isn't world class? Of course it is. That score at the last four Olympics would have gotten the following place finishes:
2012 8th place
2008, 6th place
2004, 7th place
2000, 9th place

Eaton received some version of these know-nothing predictions right up until he proved everyone wrong. And he didn't stop his momentum to focus on this or that. He focused on the decathlon as a whole. In order to be a force in the decathlon, Cato doesn't need to show us jack. He needs to stay the course and focus on the improvement of his overall decathlon score.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:07 pm

I thought to answer with a long post but instead I decided to quote someone that I usually value his opinion:
Cato and throws -

decafan wrote:First; not only is it easy to improve the throws at this point in Cato's development, it is fully expected. The shocking thing would be if he didn't improve. Don't base his lack of improvement on one meet. He threw worse than that at Indoor NCAA's last year. Young decathletes can be very inconsistent in the shot. Throws are very technical in nature. Young decathletes don't need to add much strength or muscle mass to improve their throws.

The answer (decfan on Beach):
decafan wrote:Nevertheless, olorin, you're clearly right that he needs to improve his throws (without having a major negative impact on his other events - the decathlon difficulty!) over the next couple of years if he is going to be a threat internationally.


The argument:
decafan wrote:Cato doesn't need to show us jack. He needs to stay the course and focus on the improvement of his overall decathlon score.


The answer (again decfan on Beach)
decafan wrote:His PRs presently sum to about 8300; I can see another 30 points or so in each of the hurdles, PV, and LJ, but the big point improvements will have to come in the throws. Even 13.8 SP, 53 JT and 42 DT would add 180 points to his total.

My own two cents:
Cato's PRs presently sum to about 8000; I can see another 60 points or so in each of the hurdles, PV, LJ, 100 and the 1500, but the big point improvements will have to come in the throws. Even 13.8 SP, 53 JT and 42 DT would add ~400 points to his total.

Finally, in many respects I am a know nothing predictor. I get to see these athletes once or twice a year on TV when they compete in major championship. I don’t know their individual stories, whether their results are affected by a nagging injury or a personal crisis at home. The only thing I do know is their results (that I follow quite closely) and how it compare to other decathletes. The other advantage that I have is that unlike many expert I do my predictions objectively. I would still argue that right now Cato seems to have less potential than the likes of Taiwo, Scantling , Nixon and probably Lazas. This fact indicates more about the unbelievable generation on young decathletes than on Cato himself.

I will leave the semintic argument as to whether 8250 is a world class performance to other time. Just one question do you believe it will be enough to make the American team in the coming years?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:47 pm

By the way, Cato hit 7.70 in the Hept and while only taking two jumps in the open LJ (taking place arou9nd the time of the Hept HJ, I think) he hit 7.85/25'9.25", which puts him about 5-6 in NCAAs right now.

Standing next to him, you get the physical feeling that when he gets technique down it would not be beyond the pale for him to hit 15 SP, 45 in the DT and 50+ in the JT. He has a pretty big wing span and is pretty strongly muscled for his current set of marks.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:22 pm

Here is the list of the top 18 for the NCAAs. Drouin is not a surprise but Taiwo is listed with an "S", which is scratch, I think. Did he get injured (again)?

A= to be considered
S= scratched
[blank]= nothing submitted

1 6156 S Jeremy Taiwo SR Washington
2 6090 A Japheth Cato JR Wisconsin
3 6042 A Kevin Lazas JR Arkansas
4 5889 A Garrett Scantling SO Georgia
5 5858 A Johannes Hock FR Texas
6 5846 A Zach Ziemek SO Wisconsin
7 5817 S Derek Drouin SR Indiana
8 5756 A Romain Martin SR Texas-Arling
9 5755 A Maicel Uibo FR Georgia
10 5753 A Dakotah Keys JR Oregon
11 5725 A Jeff Mohl SR Montana Stat
12 5685 A Andy Lillejord JR North Dakota
13 5682 A Ethan Miller SR Northern Iow
14 5670 A Marcus Nilsson SO UCLA
15 5669 A Austin Bahner JR Wichita Stat
16 5651 A Austin Emry JR Montana
17 5607 A Alex McCune SO Akron
18 5603 A Devin Dick SR Kansas State
19 5600 A Clayton Chaney SR Rice
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:02 am

26mi235 wrote:Here is the list of the top 18 for the NCAAs. Drouin is not a surprise but Taiwo is listed with an "S", which is scratch, I think. Did he get injured (again)?

A= to be considered
S= scratched
[blank]= nothing submitted

1 6156 S Jeremy Taiwo SR Washington
2 6090 A Japheth Cato JR Wisconsin
3 6042 A Kevin Lazas JR Arkansas
4 5889 A Garrett Scantling SO Georgia
5 5858 A Johannes Hock FR Texas
6 5846 A Zach Ziemek SO Wisconsin
7 5817 S Derek Drouin SR Indiana
8 5756 A Romain Martin SR Texas-Arling
9 5755 A Maicel Uibo FR Georgia
10 5753 A Dakotah Keys JR Oregon
11 5725 A Jeff Mohl SR Montana Stat
12 5685 A Andy Lillejord JR North Dakota
13 5682 A Ethan Miller SR Northern Iow
14 5670 A Marcus Nilsson SO UCLA
15 5669 A Austin Bahner JR Wichita Stat
16 5651 A Austin Emry JR Montana
17 5607 A Alex McCune SO Akron
18 5603 A Devin Dick SR Kansas State
19 5600 A Clayton Chaney SR Rice


Taiwo is listed as competing in the high jump, with an "A" next to his name. So I'm guessing he is not ready for a full heptathlon right now, but does not have a significant injury.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:22 am

In the women front Sharon Day had a good start to her outdoor campaign. In the same competition that Eaton broke his JT PB she set a new outdoor PB in the SP (14.77)and jumped only a cm less than her LJ PB (6.14). An improvement in the LJ is a must for Day as she is ~40 cm behind most of her competitors (130 points!).
The difference right now between men and women in the multi events in the US is amazing. The men are ranked 1 and 2 in the world with 5 new talents that score 6,000+ in the heptathlon this winter. The women will be lucky to make it to the top 10 with no real threat for a medal.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:15 am

az2004 wrote:suspect eaton has moscow on his mind

no world indoors shapes his schedule a bit

as i posted in a thread, zelinka is with rovelto

interesting to see how she fairs


Looks like Eaton will be starting at Gotzis this year.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:32 pm

olorin wrote:In the women front Sharon Day had a good start to her outdoor campaign. In the same competition that Eaton broke his JT PB she set a new outdoor PB in the SP (14.77)and jumped only a cm less than her LJ PB (6.14). An improvement in the LJ is a must for Day as she is ~40 cm behind most of her competitors (130 points!).
The difference right now between men and women in the multi events in the US is amazing. The men are ranked 1 and 2 in the world with 5 new talents that score 6,000+ in the heptathlon this winter. The women will be lucky to make it to the top 10 with no real threat for a medal.


I'm amazed about how poorly American heptathletes, of all ages, long jump (with extremely rare exceptions). Some even jump 19-20 in HS and then regress to 17-18 in college and later. If as a pro you can't do 21 feet in the heptathlon LJ it's pointless to stay in the event. 18 feet is running through the pit.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:18 am

unclezadok wrote:I'm amazed about how poorly American heptathletes, of all ages, long jump (with extremely rare exceptions). Some even jump 19-20 in HS and then regress to 17-18 in college and later. If as a pro you can't do 21 feet in the heptathlon LJ it's pointless to stay in the event. 18 feet is running through the pit.


Good point

Until your post I was under the impression that the throws are the main problem of the Americans women in the heptathlon, but the LJ is probably as much as problem if not bigger.

The average top-10 in the world jump ~6.50 for a score of roughly 1,000 in 2012. The American women had one athlete above this average (Fountain), one around this average (Wade 6.41), four ~6.15 (losing close to 100 points!) and another four jumping less than six meters and losing 250-300 points in a single event.

Compare to this even the JT looks like a strong event. The top-10 in the world threw to an average distance of ~50 meters for a score of ~860 points. In the top-10 American one women threw above this distance (McMillan 50.24). three women threw in the mid-40 for a loss of ~100 points. Five threw around 40 for a loss of 200 points and only Carrier - Eades (33.11) lost more than 200 points.

The weakness of the American women in the LJ is surprising given the strength of the US in this event and the fact that the American decathletes are typically very good in this event most jumping above 7.5
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:51 am

Based on her holding ALL of the lower class HS records in the Hept (9th--4914, 10th--5170, 11th--5578), and the Indoor HSR in the Pent (4068), I'd look to Kendell Williams as a future MAJOR star on the WORLD stage!!

And she won't be 18 until June 14th this year!!

She's strong in the hurdles (8.35, 13.39), LJ (20-8 and 1/2), HJ (6 and 3/4).
Her 800 best is 2:22.38, but she has a 24.4 200, so I'm guessing she'll be around 2:12 to 2:15 eventually.
Her weaknesses are in the throws.
But that's true for most HS'ers....and maybe most Hept/Pent ladies!!

I'm thinking she'll approach....or surpass.....6000 THIS year!!
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Re: USA Multis

Postby nianchengyu » Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:08 am

aaronk wrote:Based on her holding ALL of the lower class HS records in the Hept (9th--4914, 10th--5170, 11th--5578), and the Indoor HSR in the Pent (4068), I'd look to Kendell Williams as a future MAJOR star on the WORLD stage!!

And she won't be 18 until June 14th this year!!

She's strong in the hurdles (8.35, 13.39), LJ (20-8 and 1/2), HJ (6 and 3/4).
Her 800 best is 2:22.38, but she has a 24.4 200, so I'm guessing she'll be around 2:12 to 2:15 eventually.
Her weaknesses are in the throws.
But that's true for most HS'ers....and maybe most Hept/Pent ladies!!

I'm thinking she'll approach....or surpass.....6000 THIS year!!

Combined event always intereating for me,17-year-old Kendell Williams almost has same level with dobrynska in 100mH,HJ and 200m,but 10.70m/30.48m losing 800p to 17.29m/49.25m although she is still young, :oops:
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:11 am

I've noticed that Kendell Williams is making slow if steady progress in the throws, and they are now not bad for a HS runner-jumper heptathlete. She probably doesn't train for them too much now. I think that ultimately her throws will not prevent her from becoming world class. But again, even now she should not be long jumping 19 feet in a heptathlon. I don't think she should ever be under 20.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:37 pm

unclezadok wrote:I've noticed that Kendell Williams is making slow if steady progress in the throws, and they are now not bad for a HS runner-jumper heptathlete. She probably doesn't train for them too much now. I think that ultimately her throws will not prevent her from becoming world class. But again, even now she should not be long jumping 19 feet in a heptathlon. I don't think she should ever be under 20.


I think that you are too harsh on the kid. She jumped last season seven times above 6.00m including a huge PB of 6.31. The consistency you are looking for (all jumps above 20 feet) should come with age. The LJ is one of the trickiest events with only three jumps to get it right (Eaton in Daego).

Her problem is the throws. Two athletes her age that finished ahead of her in Barcelona (Yorgelis Rodríguez from Cuba and Sofia Linde from Sweden) have slightly lower total in five of the seven events. However, both are ~13.5 and ~41.5 thrower. This is ~450 points better than Williams. There is little doubt that Williams will improve on her 10.7 and 30.5 in years to come. But in order to become a medal threat she needs to improve (at least) to ~14.5 and ~48 while being able to improve the rest of her events significantly.

At this stage I would say that short-term improvement to 6,000 is very likely, the long-term improvement to ~6750 is still highly questionable.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:39 pm

While we all follow the Eaton's path to become a super human some other American decathletes set impressive results:

Taiwo - Set an outdoor PB in the SP 13.30 (previous 13.08), still well below his indoor best. He also jumped 4.85 only one cm from his PB (after 4.25 in the indoor season).

Cato - 14.03 PB in the 110h (14.04)

Scantling - 43.66 in DT an improvement of 4.5 meters (!!), additionally 14.73 PB in the 110h (14.93). Now do you believe 8000 in the decathlon Marlow?

Ziemek - 44.45 in the DT an improvement of more than 7 meters (!!) and 15.44 (15.48) in 110h

The NCAA this year....
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:04 pm

Japheth Cato Wisconsin 39.60m/129-11 was a 2m+(7'+) PR also. Note that conditions in Madison have not be conducive to throwing anything outdoors, although they do use an indoor field for throwing the discus sometimes. I also doubt that they have been running hurdles outdoors yet (except for on the road), as there is still some snow on the ground (having just arrived back home from a 2400mile west coast road trip).
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:42 am

26mi235 wrote:Japheth Cato Wisconsin 39.60m/129-11 was a 2m+(7'+) PR also. Note that conditions in Madison have not be conducive to throwing anything outdoors, although they do use an indoor field for throwing the discus sometimes. I also doubt that they have been running hurdles outdoors yet (except for on the road), as there is still some snow on the ground (having just arrived back home from a 2400mile west coast road trip).


According to all-athletics Cato mark was achieved during Alabama relay on the 23/03
Ziemek was competing in Atlanta in the last weekend.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:18 am

Cato's 39.60 mark was at the Yellow Jacket Invite 3/30; his top 110h was 14.03/0.9 at Alabama (as indicated. His 14.11/0.0 indicates (along with his 14.04) that he is consistent at that level but his indoor marks have promise for sub-14, I think.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:21 am

Don't know if this is the best place for this, but here's the top 3 women in the Jim Click Hept after the first day:

Bettie Wade...........3688 (13.81, 1.82, 13.49, 24.64)
Keia Pinnick...........3433 (13.71, 1.70, 10.59, 23.90)
Ryann Krais............3404 (14.12, 1.70, 12.81, 25.15)

Don't know for sure, but it looks like Wade is on course to score 6000 points!

After 5 events:

Wade..........4531 (19-7 and 1/2)
Pinnick........4270 (19-6 and 3/4)
Krais...........4157 (18-7 and 3/4).

Wade won it with 5867 points.
Pinnick edged Krais for 2nd, 5791 to 5781.
Last edited by aaronk on Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:57 am

Top 3 men at Jim Click Dec are:

1. Tomas Kirielius.........3939 (11.27, 6.68, 14.27, 2.02, 49.62)
2. Reinis Kregers..........3833 (11.33, 6.80, 13.71, 2.02, 51.57)
3. Jake Arnold.............3779 (11.44, 6.94, 14.33, 1.96, 50.02)

First 2 are with KS State, and Arnold, of course, is a pro.

After 6 events:

Kirielius............4719 (15.59)
Arnold..............4716 (14.29)
Kregers.............4623 (15.50).

After 7 events:

Kirielius............5521 (153-2)
Arnold..............5486 (148-1)
Kregers............5328 (137-9)
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Fri Apr 05, 2013 4:02 pm

aaronk wrote:Don't know if this is the best place for this, but here's the top 3 women in the Jim Click Hept after the first day:

Bettie Wade...........3688 (13.81, 1.82, 13.49, 24.64)
Keia Pinnick...........3433 (13.71, 1.70, 10.59, 23.90)
Ryann Krais............3404 (14.12, 1.70, 12.81, 25.15)

Don't know for sure, but it looks like Wade is on course to score 6000 points!

After 5 events:

Wade..........4531 (19-7 and 1/2)
Pinnick........4270 (19-6 and 3/4)
Krais...........4157 (18-7 and 3/4).

That long jumping is just sad.
Wade won it with 5867 points.
Pinnick edged Krais for 2nd, 5791 to 5781.
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