¶USATF Dec: Ashton Eaton 8291


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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jackaloupe » Mon Jun 10, 2013 9:26 pm

Eaton's SP is up to 15.40, in an open meet, leaving D as the only event awaiting that li'l UpGrade that's clearly in the wings, so to speak.

HJ is a current 'incognita', what with his tweaking that "tendon behind the knee" last month (that prompted pulling out of the German meet); clearly plenty of potential to consolidate 210 and above.
Last edited by Jackaloupe on Mon Jun 17, 2013 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:09 am

olorin wrote:Current ranking of US athlete after NCAA:

1 9039 Ashton EATON
2 8671 Trey HARDEE
3 8239 Jeremy TAIWO
4 8136 Gunnar NIXON
5 8086 Isaac MURPHY
6 8011 Curtis BEACH
7 8001 Dakotah KEYS
8 7955 Kevin LAZAS
9 7954 Gray HORN
10 7932 Wesley BRAY
11 7931 Joe DETMER
12 7873 Garrett SCANTLING
13 7862 Jack SZMANDA
14 7847 Austin BAHNER
15 7840 Chris RANDOLPH
16 7832 David GRZESIAK
17 7813 Terry PRENTICE
7,850 is the "A" standard to USATF so 12 athletes (assuming no injuries) already booked a place in Des Moines.
One athlete that is MIA is Miller Moss. He had one competition in which he was on his way to 8000+ score. Then, had a Beach type of JT and decided not to run the 1500. Since then I was expecting him to get the American "A" but he didn't compete. Is he injured or decided to retire?

Beach, Detmer and Scantling (Marlow?) are still not declared. Miller Moss is on the provisional lists. With a qualifying mark of 7,712 he is currently ranked 14 (out of 18 spots) from all the athletes that declared. However, there are still 10 athletes that are ranked above him that didn't declared yet so his chances are not too good.
Finally, Gray Horn (that was the only athlete beside Eaton to do well in Eugene last year) competed in Ottawa just before the NCAA finals. He scored ~7,500 and broke one individual PB (110h) in conditions that could rival Gotizs.

EDIT: Beach is now on the starting line up. Another big name that is missing is Lazas. In the NCAA he had very poor 400 & 1500. I thought (and hoped) that he is conserving for the USATF. But, maybe something is wrong with him.
Last edited by olorin on Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:01 am

olorin wrote:Beach, Detmer and Scantling (Marlow?) are still not declared. Miller Moss is on the provisional lists. With a qualifying mark of 7,712 he is currently ranked 14 (out of 18 spots) from all the athletes that declared. However, there are still 10 athletes that are ranked above him that didn't declared yet so his chances are not too good.
Finally, Gray Horn (that was the only athlete beside Eaton to do well in Eugene last year) competed in Ottawa just before the NCAA finals. He scored ~7,500 and broke one individual PB (110h) in conditions that could rival Gotizs.


Beach appeared to be hurt at the NCAAs (115' in the JT would indicate shoulder issues).
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:25 pm

I have seen no word on Detmer at all this year (although I did see that his sister Anne was running at least semi-seriously) and he is not on the entry list. Someone I know her said the same.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby gktrack » Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:23 am

Only a handful of days left and not on the entry list are Lazas and Scantling (who had a 4-5 second 1500 PR at NCAA's to get 7850+), and no comeback for Morrison I guess this year.
http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2013/USATFCS/Events/USA-Outdoor-Track---Field-Championships/Status-of-Entries.aspx
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:46 am

gktrack wrote:Only a handful of days left and not on the entry list are Lazas and Scantling (who had a 4-5 second 1500 PR at NCAA's to get 7850+), and no comeback for Morrison I guess this year.
http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2013/USATFCS/Events/USA-Outdoor-Track---Field-Championships/Status-of-Entries.aspx


Lazas' absence doesn't surprise me. This would be his 3rd deca in just over a month and to what end? Improving from 7933 to 8200 would be unlikely, so why beat up the body any more, even though others in similar circumstances have made the decision to compete.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby 26mi235 » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:39 am

He only needs to be the first "B" athlete; does not necessarily require the A standard be met.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jackaloupe » Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:53 pm

Beach appeared to be hurt at the NCAAs (115' in the JT would indicate shoulder issues).

Yup, that was known (Trust me) going in. It's a wonder he was vaulting so well w/ a bad right shoulder (He cleared 15 ft. nicely, then had a couple of poor efforts at higher heights.) And he sure didn't use the arm much at all in the Jav, trying to compensate with a quick approach.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:12 pm

bruce3404 wrote:
gktrack wrote:Only a handful of days left and not on the entry list are Lazas and Scantling (who had a 4-5 second 1500 PR at NCAA's to get 7850+), and no comeback for Morrison I guess this year.
http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2013/USATFCS/Events/USA-Outdoor-Track---Field-Championships/Status-of-Entries.aspx


Lazas' absence doesn't surprise me. This would be his 3rd deca in just over a month and to what end? Improving from 7933 to 8200 would be unlikely, so why beat up the body any more, even though others in similar circumstances have made the decision to compete.


Lazas 7933 include:
A close foul in the SP for a distance of ~15.00m
A pedestrian 400 run of 52.0 (PB 50.38)
A pedestrian 1500 run of 4:48.35 (PB 4:31.33)
If Lazas would have gotten two of these three right he would be out there with Hock and Taiwo.
Throughout the summer campaign Lazas perform below expectations. If he indeed will not compete in the USATF then most likely he has an injury. If he decides to compete he will be my dark horse for the competition.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jseven1 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:11 am

Per Eugene newspaper, Eaton cleared 18' feet in the PV in practice recently
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jackaloupe » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:43 am

Holy Cow! (A local eatery in Eugene, serving small tasty portions of so-called Natural Food, nothing like Cornbread Café, the best Vegan place around). Doesn't surprise me after OlyTrials, where he was great over 17'4" before moving along to Jav, with excellent form and controlled speed--always a factor with Eaton, a "problem" it's nice to have, thus helping to explain his short HJ approach and Jav limited to X-steps.

Let's just hope he keeps choosing the right starting height...
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 9:16 am

Jackaloupe wrote:
Let's just hope he keeps choosing the right starting height...


I'm thinking those heights will be very low in Des Moines. The only way he doesn't make the team is NH or fouling out, so expect a safety on the first SP, JT, DT and LJ attempts and early entrance into the PV and HJ competitions. All in all, should be a pedestrian work out which accomplishes the main goal, though in the unlikely event that someone is pushing him for the national title, he would surely step it up in the 1500.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jseven1 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 10:13 am

Here is full quote in Eugene paper 6 days ago. My question: does "play it safe" mean not only starting low but stopping early. When you only do your event twice a year wouldn't you want to go all out in both.


"Marra said Eaton, who skipped the trip to Götzis as a precautionary measure because of a minor knee injury, is in “great shape.” He’s lighter than ever at 178 pounds and recently cleared 18 feet in a pole vault practice.

Eaton, the world-record holder at 9,039 points, needs a top-three finish and a score of 8,000 or better to advance; he’s done that in his past 14 decathlons, dating back to June of 2008.

“We’ll play it safe,” Marra said. “Let’s nail the 100 and long jump and do the same stuff we do in practice. If we can do that, the score will take care of itself.”"
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:58 am

Jseven1 wrote:Here is full quote in Eugene paper 6 days ago. My question: does "play it safe" mean not only starting low but stopping early.


That's the way I read it. In the same article or perhaps another article in the same time frame, Marra expressed that he found it silly that either of his athletes had to compete in Nationals. Given that Eaton is 800 points better than any of his competition and that Theisen is roughly 500 points better, you can see his point. They both have A's, they're both vastly better than any other team contenders and they both compete in grueling events that have no comparison in the track world. Perhaps Eaton would have competed in an earlier meet had he not been forced to compete in Des Moines. The good news is that Eaton's and Theisen's vast superiority will enable both to work towards a peak in August, rather than June. The bad news is that multis fans will probably have more interest in the battles for supporting team slots rather than the main characters.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby norunner » Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:06 pm

So what is up with Hardee? All i could find for him this year is an SP from may, nothing else. Has he competed at all? Since he has a wild card for Moscow, will he have to compete in Eugene at all? I know he withdrew from Götzis but i thought there would be some news, i mean he's gotta do something?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby gktrack » Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:24 pm

Yes, Hardee has to show up in Des Moines and participate in at least one event, that's all, and he'll qualify for Moscow. I read a while back he's just going to do some selected deca events(?), but as you mentioned, I have not seen almost anything from him outdoors this season, so I have no idea where he's at.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Dave » Sun Jun 16, 2013 9:45 pm

Jseven1 wrote:Per Eugene newspaper, Eaton cleared 18' feet in the PV in practice recently


I always thought the pv was an under exploited stength for Eaton. This hopefully means he can grab another 100 pts.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby nianchengyu » Mon Jun 17, 2013 3:17 am

Dave wrote:
Jseven1 wrote:Per Eugene newspaper, Eaton cleared 18' feet in the PV in practice recently


I always thought the pv was an under exploited stength for Eaton. This hopefully means he can grab another 100 pts.

wow,if it is truw,that is 5.486m,what can the man do.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:25 am

nianchengyu wrote:
Dave wrote:
Jseven1 wrote:Per Eugene newspaper, Eaton cleared 18' feet in the PV in practice recently


I always thought the pv was an under exploited stength for Eaton. This hopefully means he can grab another 100 pts.

wow,if it is truw,that is 5.486m,what can the man do.


That's just nuts. I know they keep records for fastest running times in a deca (and Eaton broke that record during his Jr year in college, btw), so I'm guessing someone has stats on what might be called the jumping events (HJ, PV, LJ); wondering where Eaton stands in that group (if he's not already number one)?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Fortius19 » Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:17 am

bruce3404 wrote:That's just nuts. I know they keep records for fastest running times in a deca (and Eaton broke that record during his Jr year in college, btw), so I'm guessing someone has stats on what might be called the jumping events (HJ, PV, LJ); wondering where Eaton stands in that group (if he's not already number one)?


I believe Tom Pappas is the unofficial "record holder" for best jumps.

7.96 +1.4 / 2.21 / 5.20
1050 + 1002 + 972 = 3024 points

AE
8.23 +0.8 / 2.11 / 5.30
1120 + 906 + 1004 = 3030 points

Wow, I guess Ashton eclipsed Tom last year in Eugene. I guess setting the Deca WR for LJ and a PV PR on top of an already good mark will do that.

5.50 (~18 ft) is another 63 points on top of that.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:24 am

Fortius19 wrote:
bruce3404 wrote:That's just nuts. I know they keep records for fastest running times in a deca (and Eaton broke that record during his Jr year in college, btw), so I'm guessing someone has stats on what might be called the jumping events (HJ, PV, LJ); wondering where Eaton stands in that group (if he's not already number one)?


I believe Tom Pappas is the unofficial "record holder" for best jumps.

7.96 +1.4 / 2.21 / 5.20
1050 + 1002 + 972 = 3024 points

AE
8.23 +0.8 / 2.11 / 5.30
1120 + 906 + 1004 = 3030 points

Wow, I guess Ashton eclipsed Tom last year in Eugene. I guess setting the Deca WR for LJ and a PV PR on top of an already good mark will do that.

5.50 (~18 ft) is another 63 points on top of that.


Thanks, Fortius. I guess all he needs to go for now is the throws component and who knows, a better DT and JT might allow for what will probably never be a great SP. Still, I'm thinking at this point he's not even in the top 50.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby DecFan » Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:06 am

bruce3404 wrote:
Fortius19 wrote:
bruce3404 wrote:That's just nuts. I know they keep records for fastest running times in a deca (and Eaton broke that record during his Jr year in college, btw), so I'm guessing someone has stats on what might be called the jumping events (HJ, PV, LJ); wondering where Eaton stands in that group (if he's not already number one)?


I believe Tom Pappas is the unofficial "record holder" for best jumps.

7.96 +1.4 / 2.21 / 5.20
1050 + 1002 + 972 = 3024 points

AE
8.23 +0.8 / 2.11 / 5.30
1120 + 906 + 1004 = 3030 points

Wow, I guess Ashton eclipsed Tom last year in Eugene. I guess setting the Deca WR for LJ and a PV PR on top of an already good mark will do that.

5.50 (~18 ft) is another 63 points on top of that.


Thanks, Fortius. I guess all he needs to go for now is the throws component and who knows, a better DT and JT might allow for what will probably never be a great SP. Still, I'm thinking at this point he's not even in the top 50.


You can keep these records several ways:
a) Sum the scores from a single decathlon
b) Sum the scores from marks made in any decathlon
c) Sum the scores from PRs, made in any competition

Decathlon2000.com keeps the first type of records. Eaton still trails Pappas on the jumps in this scoring:
Pappas (US champs 2003 Palo Alto) 7.96 2.17 5.20 = 2985
Eaton (US champs 2012 Eugene) 8.23 2.05 5.30 = 2974

On the throws, the top 2 are:
Michael Smith (Gotzis 1996) 16.94 52.90 71.22 = 2748
Bryan Clay (World Champs 2005 Helsinki) 16.25 53.68 72.00 = 2734

Eaton's best on the throws in one decathlon:
(OG London 2012) 14.66 42.53 61.96 = 2252

Note that only Sebrle appears in the top 10 in all three categories: He is 6th in the running events (3644), 6th in the jumps (2896) and tied for 9th in the throws (2614). The only other decathlete, in addition to Eaton, who appears in the top 10 in two different categories is O'Brien: 5th in running events (3656) and 3rd in jumps (2932).
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:12 am

Fortius19 wrote:
bruce3404 wrote:That's just nuts. I know they keep records for fastest running times in a deca (and Eaton broke that record during his Jr year in college, btw), so I'm guessing someone has stats on what might be called the jumping events (HJ, PV, LJ); wondering where Eaton stands in that group (if he's not already number one)?


I believe Tom Pappas is the unofficial "record holder" for best jumps.

7.96 +1.4 / 2.21 / 5.20
1050 + 1002 + 972 = 3024 points

AE
8.23 +0.8 / 2.11 / 5.30
1120 + 906 + 1004 = 3030 points

Wow, I guess Ashton eclipsed Tom last year in Eugene. I guess setting the Deca WR for LJ and a PV PR on top of an already good mark will do that.
5.50 (~18 ft) is another 63 points on top of that.

From decathlon 2000 (very good site for these kind of things:
P Decathlete Nation Points LJ HJ PV Venue
1 Tom Pappas......USA 2985 7.96 2.17 5.20 Palo Alto 2003
2 Ashton Eaton....USA 2974 8.23 2.05 5.30 Eugene 2012
3 Dan O'Brien......USA 2932 7.81 2.17 5.15 Knoxville 1994
4 Erki Nool.........EST 2915 8.10 1.99 5.40 Götzis 1995
5 Plaetsen.........BEL 2911 7.79 2.17 5.10 Daegu 2011
6 Roman Šebrle...CZE 2896 7.92 2.12 5.10 München 2002
7 Krauchanka......BLR 2889 7.90 2.15 5.00 Götzis 2007
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Fortius19 » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:11 am

Good stuff gentlemen. Thank you.

As far as I know, I was picking marks from the catagory (b).

Counting open marks doesn't seem right, but I don't see the need for them to necessarily all be in the same competition. But, interesting to keep both sets of stats!
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Re: USA Multis

Postby bruce3404 » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:21 am

Fortius19 wrote:Good stuff gentlemen. Thank you.

As far as I know, I was picking marks from the catagory (b).

Counting open marks doesn't seem right, but I don't see the need for them to necessarily all be in the same competition. But, interesting to keep both sets of stats!


I think they should definitely not count open marks and I do think the marks should be accumulated in the same competition. Nonetheless, we have both sets, so the customers can make their own choices.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:31 am

Note that Kendell Williams is in the Hept at the USATF JR's!!
Will she reach 6000 points?
Or at least break her HSR of 5578??

I'm guessing YES on the latter....and a MAYBE on the former!! :D

I believe there's going to be a free livestream of the JR multis!!

Her marks in the 5578:

13.74
1.81
10.70
24.94
6.11
30.48
2:26.60
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Tue Jun 18, 2013 11:11 am

aaronk wrote:Note that Kendell Williams is in the Hept at the USATF JR's!!
Will she reach 6000 points?
Or at least break her HSR of 5578??

I'm guessing YES on the latter....and a MAYBE on the former!! :D

I believe there's going to be a free livestream of the JR multis!!

Her marks in the 5578:

13.74
1.81
10.70
24.94
6.11
30.48
2:26.60


It would certainly not be a big shock if she improved considerably on the 13.74, 24.94, and 6.11.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby gktrack » Tue Jun 18, 2013 1:01 pm

nice article on how wind readings can impact qualifying, etc. (on T&FN home page)...
http://decathlonusa.typepad.com/files/volumexxxviiinumber38june52013.pdf
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Re: USA Multis

Postby gktrack » Tue Jun 18, 2013 2:53 pm

From T&FN's home page...
"USATF.TV will launch on Wednesday, June 19 with live coverage from 1 p.m.-7:20 p.m. ET and includes complete coverage of the Junior heptathlon and decathlon competition."
...Hope they show senior decathlon as well???
http://content.usatf.org/vo/?FileID=25d97252-5829-483b-9dfb-6a2ca9e19ae3&m=8055a66e-3d91-4291-9595-8ce73adb8d84&MailID=26742994
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:32 am

aaronk wrote:Note that Kendell Williams is in the Hept at the USATF JR's!!
Will she reach 6000 points?
Or at least break her HSR of 5578??

I'm guessing YES on the latter....and a MAYBE on the former!! :D

I believe there's going to be a free livestream of the JR multis!!

Her marks in the 5578:

13.74
1.81
10.70
24.94
6.11
30.48
2:26.60


She ran 13.35W!!
Already way ahead of her 5578 PR!
Another HSR in the making??

ADD: Not so good in the HJ!
She'll have to make up for it in the SP and 200!!!
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Re: USA Multis

Postby eiluke » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:15 pm

Hello guys, new decthlon fan here from germany.

As for the recent discussion, the best athlete in group of events :jumping (long, high, pole) to my knowledge is still Dan O'Brian
long 8.08
high 2.20
pole 5.25
total. 3061 pts
If you include his wind assisted (+2,3) long jump of 8.11 his PB would be even at 3069 pts
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Re: USA Multis

Postby aaronk » Wed Jun 19, 2013 1:45 pm

First day of Jr Hept is done, and Kendell Williams stands just plus-5 points over her 5578 first day.
She bested her 5578 marks in the 100H and 200, but missed her marks in the HJ and SP.

To break her own HSR, she'll need a good 2nd day.....with no real failures, and maybe one strong PR.
I'm thinking now, at best, MAYBE 5700 if everything hits right!
But a HSR's a HSR, right?!
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Wed Jun 19, 2013 2:53 pm

aaronk wrote:First day of Jr Hept is done, and Kendell Williams stands just plus-5 points over her 5578 first day.
She bested her 5578 marks in the 100H and 200, but missed her marks in the HJ and SP.

To break her own HSR, she'll need a good 2nd day.....with no real failures, and maybe one strong PR.
I'm thinking now, at best, MAYBE 5700 if everything hits right!
But a HSR's a HSR, right?!


Actually no. For someone of her age not to significantly improve a score from a year ago is not a good sign. I hope she doesn't have the usual awful LJ characteristic of most USA heptathletes. She should not be below 20-6. And to hang around 2:30 for the 800m would be lame.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Fortius19 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 2:59 pm

eiluke wrote:Hello guys, new decthlon fan here from germany.

As for the recent discussion, the best athlete in group of events :jumping (long, high, pole) to my knowledge is still Dan O'Brian
long 8.08
high 2.20
pole 5.25
total. 3061 pts
If you include his wind assisted (+2,3) long jump of 8.11 his PB would be even at 3069 pts


Welcome, eiluke!

Great first post.

When I had Pappas stuck in my head, it must have been for jumps made within one competition. But, then I just compared marks made in any decathlon between him and AE and didn't think about anyone else. Now I'm curious to see how some of the other noteworthy jumpers stack up.

I believe that PV of O'Brian's is an open mark, not made in a decathlon. Best I have for him in a deca is 5.20. That would bump the 3061 down to 3045, but still higher than AE!

I never even thought about windy marks! Good stuff.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Jseven1 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 3:19 pm

Here is first day results for Mitch Modin from the same high school as Eaton. He is second in USA Jr decathlon. Not too bad.



2 Mitch
Modin
Mt. View High School, Bend, OR 3898
-166 11.04
w: +1.3
852

6.64m
21-9 ½
w: +2.0
729
(1581)

13.66m
44-9 ¾
708
(2289)

1.93
6-4
740
(3029)

48.83
869
(3898)
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Fortius19 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 3:41 pm

Christian Schenk

7.73 / 2.27 (Deca WR) / 5.00 = 2963 points
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Wed Jun 19, 2013 3:49 pm

eiluke wrote:Hello guys, new decthlon fan here from germany.

As for the recent discussion, the best athlete in group of events :jumping (long, high, pole) to my knowledge is still Dan O'Brian
long 8.08
high 2.20
pole 5.25
total. 3061 pts
If you include his wind assisted (+2,3) long jump of 8.11 his PB would be even at 3069 pts

Welcome Eiluke to T&F news and especially to "our" little multi event community.
If you read above you will see that DecFan posted that there are three ways to examine this question:

a) Sum the scores from a single decathlon
b) Sum the scores from marks made in any decathlon
c) Sum the scores from PRs, made in any competition

Both DecFan and my posts are related to the first way. Your calculation is done as sums of PRs. It is not surprising that O'Brian is in top place in the sum of PRs as he is still the "WR" record. Eaton is closing fast both in the entire decathlon and in the jumps (current sum of PRs 3030). If the report that he is jumping ~5.50 in the PV will materials it will happen sooner than later.
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Re: USA Multis

Postby unclezadok » Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:17 pm

The thing about Eaton is that he is tending to get his best decathlon marks in the same decathlon or within 1-2 decathlons. At his level, this tends to produce WRs. Am I a genius or what?
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Re: USA Multis

Postby olorin » Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:45 pm

unclezadok wrote:The thing about Eaton is that he is tending to get his best decathlon marks in the same decathlon or within 1-2 decathlons. At his level, this tends to produce WRs. Am I a genius or what?

Of course you are a genius, regardless of the accuracy of your post
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Re: USA Multis

Postby Dave » Wed Jun 19, 2013 6:02 pm

Does eaton go for it or play it safe at nationals? He didn't exactly play it safe at the trials last year.
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