GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m


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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby Ned Ryerson » Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:15 am

mump boy wrote:It's politics

Who's Shana's coach ??


George Williams
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby athlete101 » Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:27 am

mump boy wrote:
athlete101 wrote:I don't believe it is Lloyd. She left after the Olympics and this indoor would be her first return to the UK.

Its not political...UKA/BA wanted all individual athletes to run in the relay and gave them first refusal. Mens & Womens. Especially considering all three representatives made their respective Finals. For that reason alone I do not see any problem with that decision.


Who are you, Shana's mum ? it's ludicrous

Not only is MA considerably faster but she is fresh and Shana only made final because someone fell over and someone else was DQ'd and ended up running outside 53.

Do you honestly think a hungry, fresh, faster MA would run worse in the relay ??

The fact that UKA wanted all individual athletes to run in relay makes is absolutely political. It's nothing to do with who has better form but ticking boxes. Shana's lucky she's even in the team through the trials MA is blatantly faster and has more speed which is key indoors


What precisely are you on about?! you asked a question, and i answered it. If you don't like my answer then dont respond with a childish and pathetic reply.

I havent in any part of my posts given an opinion about who will run quicker.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby mump boy » Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:57 am

Ned Ryerson wrote:
mump boy wrote:It's politics

Who's Shana's coach ??


George Williams


When she's in the US but Lloyd used to coach her when she was in UK. I'm wondering who she trains with when she's in UK now.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby lionelp1 » Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:31 am

The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby mump boy » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:36 am

To be fair Shana can great in the relay 52.2, a lot better than the individual but that's not really the point
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby samthemainman » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:52 am

Agreed on Shana on both counts - good run but not the point - pleased with all the girls overall. TBO ran a 51.8 I understand. Solid start from Eilidh after her final run and a good anchor as always from PSD.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby iain » Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:36 pm

lionelp1 wrote:The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.

The team selectors had no choice, as she was top-2 in the trials with the standard. Also, don't call her 'the American' that path is well worn and just makes you seem bitter.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby eldanielfire » Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:47 pm

iain wrote:
lionelp1 wrote:The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.

The team selectors had no choice, as she was top-2 in the trials with the standard. Also, don't call her 'the American' that path is well worn and just makes you seem bitter.


I agree. It goes down the path of Mo Farah isn't British etc.

At the end of the day Cox ran a good leg in a team that broke the British and Championship record. There is no guarantee Adeyoe would go faster on the day and given the nature of indoor 400m runs she could have tripped, not worked out hoe to get around somebody or her lack of 400m experience meant she could have blown up in a championship race. Better than her have done it before.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby John G » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:13 am

mump boy wrote:
samthemainman wrote:Mump - I'm not surprised by your comment on Margaret/Shana but I hope you're wrong (as I'm sure you are too). Shana will be a lot more experienced - but come on UKA, this is a Euro Indoor 4x400m. Margaret's in great form, Shana isn't. Stick her on a middle leg - what have you got to worry about? Providing she doesn't go shooting off I don't get the risk. Put Shana on 1st and she's the kind of runner that will always hand over in 3rd....


It's politics

Who's Shana's coach ??


I think the identity of Margaret's coach may have been more of a factor. Christie's squad never seem to get any slack.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby John G » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:16 am

mump boy wrote:To be fair Shana can great in the relay 52.2, a lot better than the individual but that's not really the point


Off a rolling start, Margaret could have been expected to run mid-51s. Old news now though .. .. .. .. .

FWIW, I thought maybe Shana ran for the team in the individual. Considering the lane 1 draw I thought she ran a blinding first 200m and suspected she did so to get in the way of the Czech women. Not that PSD needed any help yesterday!!
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby 26mi235 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:19 am

eldanielfire wrote:
iain wrote:
lionelp1 wrote:The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.

The team selectors had no choice, as she was top-2 in the trials with the standard. Also, don't call her 'the American' that path is well worn and just makes you seem bitter.


I agree. It goes down the path of Mo Farah isn't British etc.

At the end of the day Cox ran a good leg in a team that broke the British and Championship record. There is no guarantee Adeyoe would go faster on the day and given the nature of indoor 400m runs she could have tripped, not worked out hoe to get around somebody or her lack of 400m experience meant she could have blown up in a championship race. Better than her have done it before.


Interesting here that Cox is running so much better in the 4x400 than in the open 400. Few of her compatriots do (though there have been some big exceptions, others are better informed here than am I). Note that Cox went through the US high school and college system that seems to turn out athletes that know how to run the 4x400.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby mump boy » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:39 am

26mi235 wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
iain wrote:
lionelp1 wrote:The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.

The team selectors had no choice, as she was top-2 in the trials with the standard. Also, don't call her 'the American' that path is well worn and just makes you seem bitter.


I agree. It goes down the path of Mo Farah isn't British etc.

At the end of the day Cox ran a good leg in a team that broke the British and Championship record. There is no guarantee Adeyoe would go faster on the day and given the nature of indoor 400m runs she could have tripped, not worked out hoe to get around somebody or her lack of 400m experience meant she could have blown up in a championship race. Better than her have done it before.


Interesting here that Cox is running so much better in the 4x400 than in the open 400. Few of her compatriots do (though there have been some big exceptions, others are better informed here than am I). Note that Cox went through the US high school and college system that seems to turn out athletes that know how to run the 4x400.


Normally i would agree with this but last year she ran a 52.6 opener for us in London. Only NGR started slower and it killed us :(
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby iain » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:27 am

26mi235 wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
iain wrote:
lionelp1 wrote:The American Cox is frigging lucky to be in Goteberg; currently a 53 sec runner and it was a bad decision by the team selectors. Last year she managed a couple of performances which early in the season were in the States and this season she has NOT impressed.

The team selectors had no choice, as she was top-2 in the trials with the standard. Also, don't call her 'the American' that path is well worn and just makes you seem bitter.


I agree. It goes down the path of Mo Farah isn't British etc.

At the end of the day Cox ran a good leg in a team that broke the British and Championship record. There is no guarantee Adeyoe would go faster on the day and given the nature of indoor 400m runs she could have tripped, not worked out hoe to get around somebody or her lack of 400m experience meant she could have blown up in a championship race. Better than her have done it before.


On the contrary I would say Shana is one of our poorest relay runners (though she did well yesterday)
Interesting here that Cox is running so much better in the 4x400 than in the open 400. Few of her compatriots do (though there have been some big exceptions, others are better informed here than am I). Note that Cox went through the US high school and college system that seems to turn out athletes that know how to run the 4x400.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby eldanielfire » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:41 am

mump boy wrote:
Normally i would agree with this but last year she ran a 52.6 opener for us in London. Only NGR started slower and it killed us :(


Ran out in lane 7, that is always tough. Wouldn't have affected the result anyway, there was USA, daylight, Russia and then Jamaica, daylight, the rest of the world.

As I said there is no definite guarantee Adeyoe would have done better than Cox and in championships experience is vital. At the end of the day Gold and a British and Championship record is as an outstanding result as you could hope for and Cox deserves credit for her role in that and in my opinion ensuring Perri and Eilidh got their medals. Cox all but ensured Hjelmer, Rosolova and Helnova were unable to maintain their speeds at the lane break giving them that gap. I'm certain Hjelmer and Rosonova would have found it easier to attack earlier without a sizable girl like Cox having run that first 260m and blocking their way. Though I was pleased all 3 athletes got a medal anyway in the championships.

Also IMO Cox isn't a great starter but a good second in relays and can hold a good position and make whomever is behind her expend too much energy getting around, an important tactic of 4x400m running when you have that position in a competitive race. The girl's team was sport on in my opinion.
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby 26mi235 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:50 am

eldanielfire wrote:
mump boy wrote:
Normally i would agree with this but last year she ran a 52.6 opener for us in London. Only NGR started slower and it killed us :(


Ran out in lane 7, that is always tough. Wouldn't have affected the result anyway, there was USA, daylight, Russia and then Jamaica, daylight, the rest of the world.


And it is the lead off leg, which does not have the same feel as the rest of the 4x400, since it is run with staggers that are even larger than the open 400 so it is hard to judge your efforts (indoors, of course, only has the first couple of turns in staggered).
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby jjimbojames » Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:41 am

26mi235 wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
mump boy wrote:
Normally i would agree with this but last year she ran a 52.6 opener for us in London. Only NGR started slower and it killed us :(


Ran out in lane 7, that is always tough. Wouldn't have affected the result anyway, there was USA, daylight, Russia and then Jamaica, daylight, the rest of the world.


And it is the lead off leg, which does not have the same feel as the rest of the 4x400, since it is run with staggers that are even larger than the open 400 so it is hard to judge your efforts (indoors, of course, only has the first couple of turns in staggered).

Er - weren't you just extolling her virtues of being a relay runner, having learnt her trade in college? :? The woman ran 52.8 in the final, having run 51.7 in the heats to lead off there too. Maybe if she'd been a bit quicker, we would have been in contact a bit more for the likes of TBO and PSD to run people down? She just isn't that great a relay runner, and seems to have regressed since her American days, if anything.

The fact that she is also only the fifth best GBR woman this indoors is also amazing (for various reasons) but I agree she ran a decent leg yesterday and tried her best in the individual - she just didn't have it up against some women in great shape
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Re: GBR Women's Indoor 400m and 4x400m

Postby mump boy » Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:26 pm

26mi235 wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
mump boy wrote:
Normally i would agree with this but last year she ran a 52.6 opener for us in London. Only NGR started slower and it killed us :(


Ran out in lane 7, that is always tough. Wouldn't have affected the result anyway, there was USA, daylight, Russia and then Jamaica, daylight, the rest of the world.


And it is the lead off leg, which does not have the same feel as the rest of the 4x400, since it is run with staggers that are even larger than the open 400 so it is hard to judge your efforts (indoors, of course, only has the first couple of turns in staggered).


I totally accept Eldanielfire's points above but this comment doesn't make any sense, EVERYONE was on the first leg (obviously) yet every one apart from NGR ran faster, he ran a second faster in the heat. This, nor any of the comments about Gothenburg are a criticism of Shana she ran great in the relay at the weekend but there was no indication before hand that she would do so. Although she does have a collegiate background and we were all VERY excited when we heard she had declared for UK, her performances have been rather underwhelming and she hasn't approached her 2008 best in a GBR vest. The idea that Margaret is unable to get round a track without incident is just rather offensive, the French had Soumare on first leg and she managed it and she doesn't even seem to have ever run a 400m indoors and not outdoors since '08 !! I don't know what she ran but they managed a national record

The issue is with a selection process which not based on what is the best team but is only there to protect the coaches and selectors. If this had been the only time that stupid decisions had been made that would be fine but it is constant, i honestly can't think of an occasion where there hasn't been some controversy.

As was mentioned above with this kind of thinking John Regis would never have been selected for Split or Tokyo and those were rather more important occasions than the euro indoors.

We need new blood in the 4x4 we always have 1 week link and on indoor form MA could be just what we need.
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