eldanielfire wrote: I cheered for ages when she won and had a tear in my eye considering the battle she had to get there and the mistakes she made that meant she was seen as something she wasn't.
Eldanielfire, thanks for your explanation concerning TBO. Could you perhaps also elaborate on your above comment.
Maybe most here, especially Britons, get what you mean, but I am less enlightened. The only thing I know that she had a doping suspension and was given a lifetime ban by the British federation, which was cancelled. But how was she seen as something she wasn't?
Basically the 3 strikes testing rule just means you give out where you will be every day. Some athletes clocked that they will only report where they will be in the morning between 6am and 9am before they leave for work or training etc so they don't have to worry about it. Ohuruogu gave details of where she would be every day, for most of the day and didn't seem to be educated to play the game like other athletes. One day she turns up for training at her usual place but finds it's booked out for a school and she hadn't been told. She drives to the her other place of training but forgets to send the update to the drug testers ho choose then to surprise her with a test. They turn-up and find she isn't there, ring her and she points out what has happened, which the drug testers can see, only she is way to far away from them to turn up in the one hour time frame they give her. They refuse to to accomodate the fact her schedule was altered by factors not under her control they deem it as avoidance too often and she is banned.
Only the whole thing is initally reported without most of the details and Chrissue O is massive national news for being a drug cheat. She taks a drug test within hours of missing it anyway to prove she isn't on drugs but the details are basically lost in headlines.
She accepts her ban for falling foul of the rules but her name is mud. When she returns she is an easy victim for people to be self-righteous despite the fact it was accepted she pretty certainly proved she hadn't done drugs, the point of the tests. Some people point out that the athletics organisation so disornagised they can let one of the training facilities of their top track medal prospect be booked out by a school without informing the athlete putting them in a more vulnerable position with the testers. She comes back, wins the world championships in dramatic fashion attacting big headlines as well and fights the life ban she has for the Olympics which is the opportunity for more inaccuarte bad headlines. Eventually her ban is overruled, some athletes speak up for her saying how her mistake could be made by anybody though loads of people still call her a cheat and she arrives under Beijing and under a cloud, unpopular and a tons of questions for why she is there for a young nieve athlete. So you can imagine the sort of pressure she was under when she won that gold.
She missed 3 tests, the 3rd before she had even been informed of the 2nd and testers NEVER call to inform that they have arrived, it was someone else at the track who called her. You have to give 1 hour a day when you will be in a specific place she had put the track instead of early morning at home because she lived with her parents and young siblings.
There is no excuse for missing 3 tests BUT UKA had done an appalling job of explaining the new rules to the athletes, many others including MLF and Becky Lynn were on 2. MLF because his door bell was broken and he didn't know they were at the door !!
Having said all of that, there she was fully culpable for missing tests and the ban was appropriate but there is a MASSIVE difference between missing tests you are totally unaware of and failing or avoiding them. It was very unfortunate that she became the high profile test case that has meant the NO other UK athlete has missed 3 tests in the last 7 years. If it happened to anyone now i would have VERY little sympathy.
mump boy wrote:This isn't wholly accurate, she missed 3 tests, the 3rd before she had even been informed of the 2nd and testers NEVER call to inform that they have arrived, it was someone else at the track who called her. TBO had put the track instead of early morning at home because she lived with her parents and young siblings.
There is no excuse for missing 3 tests BUT UKA had done an appalling job of explaining the new rules to the athletes, many others including MLF and Becky Lynn were on 2. MLF because his door bell was broken and he didn't know they were at the door !!
Having said all of that there she was fully culpable for missing tests and the ban was appropriate but there is a MASSIVE difference between missing tests you are totally unaware of and failing of avoiding them. It was very unfortunate that she became the high profile test case that has meant the NO other UK athlete has missed 3 tests in the last 7 years. If it happened again now i would have VERY little sympathy.
Thanks for filling in those details, I was rambling on from memory. I remember being outraged that she had never been informed of the 2nd test and the sheer idiotitic organiastion of athletes training and the education they got on how rules work. I think if somebody misses a test they should be informed on the day if possible that they have missed one. And yes I simply wouldn't be sympathetic to anybody if it happened today, the educaton and coordination is much better as a result.
Last edited by eldanielfire on Sun Feb 17, 2013 12:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Olli wrote:So, now I guess Ohuruogu is called TBO. Could you please finally tell me why.
It means 'The Big O'. I only learned this a couple of days ago. I guess it's partly as her surname isn't always so instinctive to spell in the moment, she is the most common athlete who isn't referred to by her last name on message boards.
Firstly it's because no one can spell her name properly but it also refers to her ability to rise to the Big occasion.
lonewolf wrote:I was not familiar with TBO's testing ordeal. I strikes me as mindless bureauracy run amok.
It wasn't. I actually fully support the system. It just hadn't been explained to the athletes properly. As I understand it the reason they are not contacted and given the chance to return is that during that time they would have the opportunity to switch urine or one of the other ways athletes get around tests. I think that in the US a phone call if made and if they return in time then it isn't counted as a missed test. Our system is much stricter but had no flexibility despite the fact that athletes clearly didn't understand it.
The British media went to town in typical fashion gatting all their facts wrong and treating her like a full blown Marion Jones. They didn't bother to report fact like one of the tests she missed because she was at a UKA photoshoot. It's not as if the governing body couldn't verify her attendance.
They also took place over the course of 9 months with numerous passed tests in between. She rightly served her sentence but the way the whole thing was reported in the UK was disgraceful and she of course will be forever labelled a drug cheat when there is no evidence she was anything of the sort.
I think so many of us UK fans are particularly supportive of her because of the way she was treated at the time especially as some of the blame should have gone to the system which was not implemented well at all. Instead she was just left to fend for herself and did a spectacularly terrible job of making her case.
Hicham 1500 (my #15) ... One of the most exciting homestretch battles in memory. With the disappointments of 96 and 00 fresh in his mind, and with the recent loss to Lagat in Zurich, would El G tighten up? NO WAY!!! He stayed focused, with that amazing stride of his, and nailed down the missing gold in majestic fashion. Now, having said that, I was rooting for Lagat almost as much as for El G. They are both among the classiest and most intensely competitive middle distance runners ever. A photo finish would have been perfect.
Flo Jo 200 (my #4) ... Unbelievable! Power, quickness, turnover, grace. Coming off the turn, I was thinking; Well she's doing ok. But the final, especially the last 50 ... WOW!!! That's when I turned to my family and said something along the lines of, DID YOU SEE THAT?!?! If it had been in the internet era, the video of the race would have had a bajillion visits in the next day.
Daisy wrote:200m and Ceremony? Is that Smith, Norman and Carlos? .
Yes it is, i've clarified now
I've combined 200m and medal ceremony as they go hand in hand, despite the 200m being a standout it gets added kudos because of what happened after
The medal stand was my No1 and how so many people can have ignored it totally is beyond me. It's not only the best Olympic moments it's one of the best moments full stop of the 20th century.
The fact that i met Tommie Smith and John Carlos last year and Mr Smith signed a poster of this moment, to me makes it even better
At the end I got into a bidding war with a tv weather girl but but there was not a hope in hell i wasn't getting my hands on it. It's framed on the wall next to my bed and is my favourite thing in the world, it makes me cry
he signed it to me, it says
'Faith, Tommie Smith Mexico City, 1968'
I've also got these, just look at how totally maze they are, they're signed and they have black power fists all over them
jazz, can I share a jazzcyclist/John Carlos moment? Last summer at the OT some of us were sitting outside the Wild Duck having a beer and burgers when gh pointed to three trim, older-ish salt-and-pepper looking guys standing across the way and said "There's Carlos" (or maybe it was "There's 'Los"). In an instant, jazz was focused on 'Los like a extremely well-trained hunting dog on the point. I even have a (slightly blurry) photo of jazz in that moment, right before he went to get HIS camera and go over to meet the man and get a few pics. Truly one of his heroes, as he mentioned in another thread last year. Can't remember who the other two gentlemen were....former national HS HJ record holder?
PS Has the image uploading function here ever been reactivated?
mump boy wrote:The medal stand was my No1 and how so many people can have ignored it totally is beyond me.
Maybe most voters are just too young to have experienced this. This applies to me, who was four at the time.
Moreover, I think I recall we were encouraged to send our lists even if we do not have time to consider them so carefully. So what I did was mostly collecting moments that popped into my mind from those Olympics I had enjoyed live (though I added a couple of earlier moments that seemed especially impressive sportwise, such as Bikila and Nurmi).
Daisy wrote:200m and Ceremony? Is that Smith, Norman and Carlos? .
Yes it is, i've clarified now
I've combined 200m and medal ceremony as they go hand in hand, despite the 200m being a standout it gets added kudos because of what happened after
The medal stand was my No1 and how so many people can have ignored it totally is beyond me. It's not only the best Olympic moments it's one of the best moments full stop of the 20th century.
The fact that i met Tommie Smith and John Carlos last year and Mr Smith signed a poster of this moment, to me makes it even better
I don't think I voted for it as it's not my favourite. It's one of the more important historical moments and one of the biggest, but not my favourite. This is sport and I enjoy the sport most of all.
Last summer mump and I went to see John Carlos talk at a cinema near the Olympic stadium. We got there early and nabbed seats right in the centre.
Big Mistake!!!
We went for athletics/Olympic reasons as in our head that's why he's famous but most of the people in attendance saw him as a political figure and an icon of the civil rights movement. Once he started talking he didn't stop for about an hour and a half. He'd be asked a question and then give a long, rambling stream of conciousness in reply, jumping all over the places, making little sense and never getting anywhere near giving a coherant answer. I had literally no idea whta he was going on about. The audience sat there rapt. Hanging off every word and when given the chance asking sychophantic questions about how inspirational he is.
It was torturous. The Olympics were hardly mentioned. I would have left but sitting right in the middle of a row facing Dr Carlos it was impossible. Mump kept nudging me as I fell asleep 4 or 5 times.
By the end local people with causes were trying to get him to sign their petitions and support their fights with the council about housing issues. I just wanted to shout.
'Why did you run such a terrible race and lose the silver medal???'.
We went to a similar event for Tommy Smith a while later which was 100 x better.
Those three are among my picks. Lewis was already written off by most people. Not medaling in 95WC and barely making the team in 96. I think that one leap in Atlanta made him a much bigger legend. (On a side note, the agony of Powell lying on the pit after his final jump was an equally lasting image.)
Hicham v Kip was the greatest duel I have seen in a middle distance race. Kip is one of my all time favorites, but I was happy for Hicham on that night after the disappointment in 1996 and 2000.
Coe v Ovett was my #1, I think. This was one of the first things I checked when old track races became available on web streaming (even before I ever heard of YouTube). The race itself was not great, but the fact that Ovett first won the gold in Coe's best event made the race really interesting. Imagine what would have happened to Coe's career had he lost that race.
Hicham v Kip was the greatest duel I have seen in a middle distance race. Kip is one of my all time favorites, but I was happy for Hicham on that night after the disappointment in 1996 and 2000.
I had Flo Jo, Coe v. Ovett, and EL G on my list, with Lewis LJ feat as an honorable mention.
Others have given great reasons which I shared. I had El G's race at #5. With so many close calls and then the epic close win in this race, this was one of the great races in the history of the event. Two of the GOAT for the event coming down to an epic battle in the stretch. Guts and long last glory for El G. It doesn't get any better than that.
Ovett upsetting Coe in the 800 and then for Coe to return the favor in the 1500 when most probably expected Ovett to win was on par as well. Great Drama. Great T&F memory!
I had this, this was the first Olympics that I really remember and Juanterena seemed like a man among boys. Much like Bolt now.
I had this as well. One of my earliest memories. Of course I was hoping Wohlhuter would win and was left in awe of Jauntarena. Seems like we shared a lot of the same picks.
Jesse Owens was one of mine. After I'd got into athletics, and was reading up on the history of the sport, this was always the big, historic event, even above Bannister's 4 minute mile.
As I grew older however I understood more and more what a great achievement this was, and the significance of a black athlete being the star of the Olympics held in the Aryan homeland in the Nazi era. At that point I realised that Owens' accomplishment transcended both his sport and indeed the Olympics themselves. This was why Carl Lewis could never match him - even by winning 4 golds, he was still only beating his competition, and not racism itself.
Jesse Owens will be remembered long after every other name in this poll fades from the world's memory.
Jessie Owens 4 golds 36 63 points (includes 100m victory)
The 1992 hurdles was extraordinary. I remember watching it on the TV in my bedroom, wondering whether Devers could go a 12.3 and having been surprised she had won the 100m. Bizarrely I recall thinking - literally - that it would be crazy if she fell or something, because she seemed such a shoe in.
Patoulidou's celebrations were fantastic and went on for an age. The exiled King (Constantine) of Greece was in the stadium going mad as well. I recall her being delighted after getting 3rd in the semi to make the final so winning must have been crazy. I don't think she ever ran a hurdles race again (though she made the Atlanta LJ final).
Tolbert had a whole host of wins on the circuit that year and looked good for a medal but clipped the 9th (I think) and just missed out. Great memories.
Rog wrote:Jesse Owens was one of mine. After I'd got into athletics, and was reading up on the history of the sport, this was always the big, historic event, even above Bannister's 4 minute mile.
As I grew older however I understood more and more what a great achievement this was, and the significance of a black athlete being the star of the Olympics held in the Aryan homeland in the Nazi era. At that point I realised that Owens' accomplishment transcended both his sport and indeed the Olympics themselves. This was why Carl Lewis could never match him - even by winning 4 golds, he was still only beating his competition, and not racism itself.
Jesse Owens will be remembered long after every other name in this poll fades from the world's memory.
A qualifier here. I am sure that many participants (myself including) voted only for persons (events) they witnessed rather than of what they know from history. Owens, Nurmi, other pre-WWII legends would receive many more votes otherwise.
Pego wrote:I am sure that many participants (myself including) voted only for persons (events) they witnessed rather than of what they know from history. Owens, Nurmi, other pre-WWII legends would receive many more votes otherwise.
I was comparing my top twenty athletes from last year, to my top twenty moments, and I am biased towards events I actually saw for the latter. That is the nature of this poll. The only moment on my list that I did not actually see was John Akii-Bua's WR from 1972. All of my picks, except for three, are 1980 or later.
Comparing my two lists, it is interesting how different they are: For example, Akii-Bua is one of my top Olympic moments, but I didn't have him in my top twenty athletes. For my top twenty athletes I had Kip Keino, Mary Rand, Don Quarrie and Peter Snell. A year later none made my Olympic moment list. Actually, only four athletes made both of my lists, Steve Ovett, Daley Thompson, Michael Johnson and Joaquim Cruz.
Disclaimer: Don't look for any internal logic in my picks.
