T&F Athletes To Unionize


Main message board: for the discussion of topical track & field items only.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:30 am

GDAWG wrote:I think this is good for track and field. They want with the IOC what the basketball players have (control of their own financial decisions and branding). They see that the basketball players (well, the men anyways, not sure about the women) not have to struggle to put food on the table for their families or work 2 or 3 jobs just to make ends meet.....


Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.

It's a very broad pyramid, and every step you go down the line adds a lot of bodies to the queue, and a finite amount of money can't be divide an infinite number of ways (although I do wholeheartedly agree that the alpha-soup suits could/should do more to pass some of the gravy along).

But at what point is somebody truly getting screwed by the system and at what point is it just somebody dreaming unrealistic dreams?

I mean, I want to write 2-3 columns a week and live in the lap of luxury. But guess what? I don't write that well, so I work 80-100 hours a week keeping my business alive. At some point in your life there has to be a reality check.
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Ned Ryerson » Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:32 am

MJR wrote:This is 100% about the athletes being able to control their own branding and financial decisions. Right now, the IOC and IAAF have an unbalanced level of control over what an athlete can do to earn a living as a professional because those groups still are designed to lord over an amateur sports world. They haven't changed with the times. The athletes are now trying to force that change and get a seat at the table for all discussions that directly affect their branding rights and earning power. This isn't about hand-outs, its about the right of self-determination, which has been denied to them. If the TFAA can come to the table as a unified voice across the sport, they'l be able affect positive change to benefit every athlete and the sport will get an influx of financial & spectator interest as a result. The only thing stopping it now is the continued head in the sand mindset of the "leaders" in charge of the alphabet groups.


Will they strike when their demands aren't met? How do you see this working?
Ned Ryerson
 
Posts: 698
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:54 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby 18.99s » Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:40 am

gh wrote:Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.


How many deserve to make a good living in the sport? As many as can find enough sponsors willing to pay them a good living, if the IAAF and IOC didn't put legalistic and bureaucratic barriers between the athletes and their (potential) sponsors.
18.99s
 
Posts: 704
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:28 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Conor Dary » Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:57 am

gh wrote:

But at what point is somebody truly getting screwed by the system and at what point is it just somebody dreaming unrealistic dreams?


Forgetting about the Olympics and fighting the IOC, which I think is rather hopeless, it is a very good question on the track scene. It doesn't seem to me that there is a boat load of money out there that already isn't available.
Last edited by Conor Dary on Sat Sep 22, 2012 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Conor Dary
 
Posts: 6297
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: कनोर दारी in Ronald MacDonald's Home Town, and once a Duck always a Duck.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sat Sep 22, 2012 12:13 pm

18.99s wrote:
gh wrote:Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.


How many deserve to make a good living in the sport? As many as can find enough sponsors willing to pay them a good living, if the IAAF and IOC didn't put legalistic and bureaucratic barriers between the athletes and their (potential) sponsors.


I really-really-really hope I'm proved wrong, but my sad take is that just about everybody who is truly "marketable" is already making that kind of money.
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby j-a-m » Sat Sep 22, 2012 12:33 pm

gh wrote:finite amount of money

Looking at the big picture, I don't think there's just a finite amount of money; instead there are plenty of opportunities to grow.
j-a-m
 
Posts: 2449
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby j-a-m » Sat Sep 22, 2012 12:42 pm

gh wrote:Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.

It's not about deserving to make a good living, but rather about deserving the opportunity to make a good living. And removing bureaucratic restrictions would give athletes better opportunities to do just that.
j-a-m
 
Posts: 2449
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby GDAWG » Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:39 pm

The state of Track and Field right now is the reason that Jeff Demps jumped ship back to football. Marquise Goodwin could do the same. If Goodwin was to play in the NFL a year from now, the least amount of money he could make is $405,000, which is the rookie minimum for 2013. Demps will make $390,000 this year alone as an "injured" player (I don't think he's seriously inured. I think he was stashed on injured reserve for the rest of the year because the Pats did not want to lose him).

If both become superstars in the NFL, chances are extremely high that they make millions (and not just on the field either), which they would have not seen had they chosen track. Goodwin is still in college now, but he's likely to make a decision within the next year or so. Will the failure of London motivate him for Rio? Or will the lure of NFL money be too much for him to turn down?
GDAWG
 
Posts: 785
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:53 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Ned Ryerson » Sat Sep 22, 2012 3:46 pm

GDAWG wrote:The state of Track and Field right now is the reason that Jeff Demps jumped ship back to football. Marquise Goodwin could do the same. If Goodwin was to play in the NFL a year from now, the least amount of money he could make is $405,000, which is the rookie minimum for 2013. Demps will make $390,000 this year alone as an "injured" player (I don't think he's seriously inured. I think he was stashed on injured reserve for the rest of the year because the Pats did not want to lose him).

If both become superstars in the NFL, chances are extremely high that they make millions (and not just on the field either), which they would have not seen had they chosen track. Goodwin is still in college now, but he's likely to make a decision within the next year or so. Will the failure of London motivate him for Rio? Or will the lure of NFL money be too much for him to turn down?


Is it a problem that Robert Griffin III can't put a Subway logo on his Redskins uniform (which, fi he could, would net him more dollars, right?)?
Ned Ryerson
 
Posts: 698
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:54 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby GDAWG » Sat Sep 22, 2012 4:01 pm

Ned Ryerson wrote:
GDAWG wrote:The state of Track and Field right now is the reason that Jeff Demps jumped ship back to football. Marquise Goodwin could do the same. If Goodwin was to play in the NFL a year from now, the least amount of money he could make is $405,000, which is the rookie minimum for 2013. Demps will make $390,000 this year alone as an "injured" player (I don't think he's seriously inured. I think he was stashed on injured reserve for the rest of the year because the Pats did not want to lose him).

If both become superstars in the NFL, chances are extremely high that they make millions (and not just on the field either), which they would have not seen had they chosen track. Goodwin is still in college now, but he's likely to make a decision within the next year or so. Will the failure of London motivate him for Rio? Or will the lure of NFL money be too much for him to turn down?


Is it a problem that Robert Griffin III can't put a Subway logo on his Redskins uniform (which, fi he could, would net him more dollars, right?)?


I don't think he cares since he's making millions based off his rookie contract. The NFL allows their players to do commercials, but they cannot have the logos on the uniforms.
GDAWG
 
Posts: 785
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:53 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby MJR » Sat Sep 22, 2012 4:14 pm

gh wrote:
18.99s wrote:
gh wrote:Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.


How many deserve to make a good living in the sport? As many as can find enough sponsors willing to pay them a good living, if the IAAF and IOC didn't put legalistic and bureaucratic barriers between the athletes and their (potential) sponsors.


I really-really-really hope I'm proved wrong, but my sad take is that just about everybody who is truly "marketable" is already making that kind of money.


GH- You're thinking Marketing in the in the Macroeconomics sense, not marketing in the microeconomics sense. This will not make T&F a big sport, but it will allow the industrious athletes & clubs the ability to fund themselves from local sources and have a greater ability to give back to those sponsors in exchange for funding. Its not about butting heads with meet directors, but making connections with regional companies that may treat the athlete with enough celebrity to fund their training in exchange for PR work, etc.
MJR
 
Posts: 1812
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: on walkabout....

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Dave » Sat Sep 22, 2012 4:39 pm

The main problem is that there are not enough events that draw enough people to make much of this sport economically viable. Athletes are paid by shoe companies for the most part rather than from the contracts associated with competitive events.

There simply is not enough money in the sport so that anyone who is not an Olympic finals caliber athlete, if even that, can make a good living.

I remember being at a Prefontaine classic the first time and wondering how all of these athletes were going to get paid for being there. It wasn't going to be a lot and it wasn't all coming from ticket sales.

I wish them luck in their efforts, but I don't see the money coming in so that many will make a real living here.
Dave
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:14 pm

MJR wrote:....

GH- You're thinking Marketing in the in the Macroeconomics sense, not marketing in the microeconomics sense. This will not make T&F a big sport, but it will allow the industrious athletes & clubs the ability to fund themselves from local sources and have a greater ability to give back to those sponsors in exchange for funding. Its not about butting heads with meet directors, but making connections with regional companies that may treat the athlete with enough celebrity to fund their training in exchange for PR work, etc.


Sorry, color me a cynic, but looking at the TFAA roster and the big-namers who are signing on, I can't imagine any of them thinking about the sport at the club level. Nor do I think that "funding at the local level" is remotely on the agenda. This remains, I fear, about the big/almost-big names being able to increase their earnings, not some grand social plan by which every hopeful gets a piece of some perhaps-not-there pie. This is the problem I have with the whole concept.
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Marlow » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:41 pm

gh wrote:not some grand social plan by which every hopeful gets a piece of some perhaps-not-there pie.

And there's the deal-breaker. What good is a union if 'collective bargaining' is over a pittance? The IOC is the only one raking in real coinage and they're going to be immune to a union, cuz they just won't care. Perhaps a union will get a few more shekels out of USATF and the IAAF, but there's no trickle-down effect to be had, cuz it'll be all dried up by the time it gets to the 'hopefuls'. The 'logo issue' is all they can accomplish at this stage, and while I hope that has some positive economic impact of the wannabes, I still don't see enough to live on.
Marlow
 
Posts: 21075
Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:00 pm
Location: Somewhere over the . . . hill

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby ExCoastRanger » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:24 pm

MJR wrote:...GH- You're thinking Marketing in the in the Macroeconomics sense, not marketing in the microeconomics sense. This will not make T&F a big sport, but it will allow the industrious athletes & clubs the ability to fund themselves from local sources and have a greater ability to give back to those sponsors in exchange for funding. Its not about butting heads with meet directors, but making connections with regional companies that may treat the athlete with enough celebrity to fund their training in exchange for PR work, etc.


I really think this is what it's all about.
Certainly most athletes have as good an idea as anybody else about how big the "pie" is and how many ways it can be sliced. If they are allowed more freedom to market themselves they will be less dependent on meet directors, global sponsors, shoe company contracts, etc. And the result may be they bring more sponsors into the sport, which seems like it could only be a good thing.
ExCoastRanger
 
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:38 pm
Location: North of where I was.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby ExCoastRanger » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:45 pm

gh wrote:...This remains, I fear, about the big/almost-big names being able to increase their earnings....


Big names should be able to increase earnings. So should everybody else. It's all relative. Focus just on the logo issue for a second. If, say, Bolt were permitted to brandish the BMW logo on his kit in exchange for $1 million and several others for several hundreds of thousands of dollars annually, that could make a big difference in his income.
Likewise for a second- or third-tier sprinter who might be able to cobble together even a few thousand dollars worth of sponsorship from his local Ford dealer and a regional bank, insurance company or nutrition provider.
ExCoastRanger
 
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:38 pm
Location: North of where I was.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby toyracer » Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:46 pm

vip wrote:What I just don't understand is why the athletes are taking their plea to the public. What exactly are we going to do? Threaten not to watch meets on TV or buy tickets? Say "pretty, pretty please" to the IOC and meet directors?

We are powerless, and unless the athletes are ready to take drastic measures -- skip the worlds or the Olympics or whatever -- they don't have the hammer in this fight. Their cause seems more like begging.


We're not powerless. Fans have a voice too. And the more fans that support a position, the louder their voices are heard.

Again I'll go back to my example using the substitute officials in the NFL: when it's the fans that are making the loudest noises for change the powers-that-be definitely listen. The balance of power shifts whenever the public has its interest on a particular side.
toyracer
 
Posts: 1759
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2009 12:38 pm
Location: Kingston, Jamaica

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby vip » Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:53 pm

Fans have a voice but I would be completely shocked if they used it to "pressure" the powers that be, in this instance. So that argument is flat.

As for the NFL and the replacement refs, fans want football so bad that they'll watch regardless, and therefore the NFL is under no financial pressure to cave to the regular refs.

Again: Fans have nothing to do with this battle, if that's what you wan to call it, between the athletes and the IOC. That's between them.
vip
 
Posts: 639
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 7:54 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby lonewolf » Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:07 pm

I have no problem with athletes sporting logos to earn sponsor money.

The problem with a union/guild is there must be a demand for your product/service and some definition of who/whom/what you are trying to influence. I don't see either.

I don't know how much the super stars or"journeymen" earn but my intuition is there is simply not enough money available to afford a comfortable living standard for the number of track and field athletes required to fill the lists of multiple meets with quality competition.
lonewolf
 
Posts: 8811
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Indian Territory

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Spickard » Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:34 pm

gh wrote:
18.99s wrote:
gh wrote:Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.


How many deserve to make a good living in the sport? As many as can find enough sponsors willing to pay them a good living, if the IAAF and IOC didn't put legalistic and bureaucratic barriers between the athletes and their (potential) sponsors.


I really-really-really hope I'm proved wrong, but my sad take is that just about everybody who is truly "marketable" is already making that kind of money.


And my sad take on your sad take is that for selfish and unethical reasons, the powers that be simply don't want the athletes to ever eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil here. It will not kill a supposedly dying sport to find out! It doesn't sit right with me to be told 100 reasons why athletes should be kept from eking out a living chasing a dream when that very same dream is the sustenance of the sport. Then to have those same athletes labelled as selfish slaves to paymasters for even bringing it up?

I have no idea whether this will work, but I'll fall on the side of optimism for the sport I cherish rather than dark clouds. We've had enough of that!
Spickard
 
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:25 am
Location: Tacoma

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby EPelle » Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:03 am

Ukrainian athletes demand change of federation leadership due to poor conditions for Olympic team preparation
http://www.interfax.com.ua/eng/press-conference/116725/
EPelle
 
Posts: 21442
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby lionelp1 » Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:32 am

gh wrote:
GDAWG wrote:I think this is good for track and field. They want with the IOC what the basketball players have (control of their own financial decisions and branding). They see that the basketball players (well, the men anyways, not sure about the women) not have to struggle to put food on the table for their families or work 2 or 3 jobs just to make ends meet.....


Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.

It's a very broad pyramid, and every step you go down the line adds a lot of bodies to the queue, and a finite amount of money can't be divide an infinite number of ways (although I do wholeheartedly agree that the alpha-soup suits could/should do more to pass some of the gravy along).

But at what point is somebody truly getting screwed by the system and at what point is it just somebody dreaming unrealistic dreams?

I mean, I want to write 2-3 columns a week and live in the lap of luxury. But guess what? I don't write that well, so I work 80-100 hours a week keeping my business alive. At some point in your life there has to be a reality check.
lionelp1
 
Posts: 281
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2012 4:48 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby j-a-m » Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:09 am

MJR wrote: it will allow the industrious athletes & clubs the ability to fund themselves from local sources and have a greater ability to give back to those sponsors in exchange for funding. Its not about butting heads with meet directors, but making connections with regional companies that may treat the athlete with enough celebrity to fund their training in exchange for PR work, etc.

Exactly. Even though most people don't follow t&f on a regular basis, the sport is still popular enough to make this good business for local sponsors. And for many athletes it can make a huge difference.
j-a-m
 
Posts: 2449
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby lionelp1 » Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:13 am

lionelp1 wrote:
gh wrote:
GDAWG wrote:I think this is good for track and field. They want with the IOC what the basketball players have (control of their own financial decisions and branding). They see that the basketball players (well, the men anyways, not sure about the women) not have to struggle to put food on the table for their families or work 2 or 3 jobs just to make ends meet.....


Now let me ask the really tough question: how many people "deserve" to make a good living from track & field? Versus people who want to make a good living.

It's a very broad pyramid, and every step you go down the line adds a lot of bodies to the queue, and a finite amount of money can't be divide an infinite number of ways (although I do wholeheartedly agree that the alpha-soup suits could/should do more to pass some of the gravy along).

But at what point is somebody truly getting screwed by the system and at what point is it just somebody dreaming unrealistic dreams?

I mean, I want to write 2-3 columns a week and live in the lap of luxury. But guess what? I don't write that well, so I work 80-100 hours a week keeping my business alive. At some point in your life there has to be a reality check.
lionelp1
 
Posts: 281
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2012 4:48 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby j-a-m » Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:15 am

ExCoastRanger wrote:If they are allowed more freedom to market themselves they will be less dependent on meet directors, global sponsors, shoe company contracts, etc. And the result may be they bring more sponsors into the sport, which seems like it could only be a good thing.

Exactly; and additional sponsors, on top of bringing more money into the sport, also bring more exposure.
j-a-m
 
Posts: 2449
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby lionelp1 » Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:21 am

I responded to gh's posts, with which I largely agree, and the message would not allow my words as the characters were over 3000 long.
Suffice to say that I think the movement to unionise will fail , irrelevant to the health of our sport and lord knows why sponsors would be interested in doling out cash to athletes unless they benefit significantly, in a less popular sport that competes 3/4 months a year in most parts of the world.

If the average run of the mill athlete finds he does not get rewarded he/ she can always do something else, but they compete because they have various levels of ability and they enjoy the sport, I suppose.

Track and Field is not Tennis, Golf, Motor Racing or National pro ball sports and will never attract the same interest, or money.
lionelp1
 
Posts: 281
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2012 4:48 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby mal » Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:33 am

This is not a union thing. Its an Olympic games rule thing.

They may need someone to negotiate that possible change, but a union will lead to nothing of great value.
mal
 
Posts: 967
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby ExCoastRanger » Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:24 am

lonewolf wrote:I have no problem with athletes sporting logos to earn sponsor money.

The problem with a union/guild is there must be a demand for your product/service and some definition of who/whom/what you are trying to influence. I don't see either.

I don't know how much the super stars or"journeymen" earn but my intuition is there is simply not enough money available to afford a comfortable living standard for the number of track and field athletes required to fill the lists of multiple meets with quality competition.


But let the athletes try to bring in their own sponsors and money into the sport and see what happens. There are plenty out there who would take, and may be able to earn, enough to at least survive in the sport longer if not achieve that comfortable living standard.
ExCoastRanger
 
Posts: 477
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:38 pm
Location: North of where I was.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby j-a-m » Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:31 am

ExCoastRanger wrote:But let the athletes try to bring in their own sponsors and money into the sport and see what happens. There are plenty out there who would take, and may be able to earn, enough to at least survive in the sport longer if not achieve that comfortable living standard.

Agreed. And what is a "comfortable living standard" anyway? A better benchmark would probably be to "make enough money to be able to follow their passion for a few more years".
j-a-m
 
Posts: 2449
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:21 pm

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby guru » Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:36 am

ExCoastRanger wrote:But let the athletes try to bring in their own sponsors and money into the sport and see what happens. There are plenty out there who would take, and may be able to earn, enough to at least survive in the sport longer if not achieve that comfortable living standard.



Exactly. Let the market decide what each athlete can earn, not the restrictive policies of the "governing" body.

And if the IAAF/IOC doesn't want to change things for fear of upsetting exclusive sponsors, then it's time for them to start passing the hundreds of millions of dollars they bring in down to the athletes, perhaps in the form of salaries.
guru
 
Posts: 10265
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Strava, racking KOMs https://tinyurl.com/qf2ntch

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Conor Dary » Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:45 am

guru wrote:
ExCoastRanger wrote:But let the athletes try to bring in their own sponsors and money into the sport and see what happens. There are plenty out there who would take, and may be able to earn, enough to at least survive in the sport longer if not achieve that comfortable living standard.



Exactly. Let the market decide what each athlete can earn, not the restrictive policies of the "governing" body.

And if the IAAF/IOC doesn't want to change things for fear of upsetting exclusive sponsors, then it's time for them to start passing the hundreds of millions of dollars they bring in down to the athletes, perhaps in the form of salaries.


I think it is pretty weird to combine the IAAF and the IOC together. The idea that the IAAF is sitting on hundreds of millions seems pretty idiotic. As mentioned elsewhere I was in the IAAF headquarters back in the 'glory' days of Primo when it was in London. And if they had that one percent of that kind of cash then, they sure hid it well. 3 Hans Crescent was hardly palatial.

Of course the IOC is another thing. But if the track people think they can budge anything out of those folks they are whistling Dixie.

And besides this talk of let the market decides is a bit contrary to the oodles folks like Bolt are making now.
Conor Dary
 
Posts: 6297
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: कनोर दारी in Ronald MacDonald's Home Town, and once a Duck always a Duck.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:51 am

The IAAF has some decidedly "palatial" real estate in Monaco (is there any other kind there?).

Having said that, it should be noted that all of the positions of power in the IAAF (President, Council, etc.) come sans salary. Although the "IAAF Family" is clearly treated well whilst on the road.
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby guru » Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:54 am

Conor Dary wrote: The idea that the IAAF is sitting on hundreds of millions seems pretty idiotic.



The IAAF's cut from London alone is expected to be in the $35-$40 million range(they received $28 million from the Beijing Games). Their annual revenue is well north of $100 million

Do your research before you start calling people idiots. I damn sure do before I post.
guru
 
Posts: 10265
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Strava, racking KOMs https://tinyurl.com/qf2ntch

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Conor Dary » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:29 am

guru wrote:
Conor Dary wrote: The idea that the IAAF is sitting on hundreds of millions seems pretty idiotic.



The IAAF's cut from London alone is expected to be in the $35-$40 million range(they received $28 million from the Beijing Games). Their annual revenue is well north of $100 million

Do your research before you start calling people idiots. I damn sure do before I post.


100 million? I thought it would be more than that. How much are they sitting on? Lots of sports have huge revenue and still lose money.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/22/sport ... wanted=all

Besides as I said linking the IOC and IAAF is foolish. The big bucks and the coattails are in the Olympics and the IOC.

By the way, if you make an argument and have some evidence it is normal to post where you got it.
Conor Dary
 
Posts: 6297
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: कनोर दारी in Ronald MacDonald's Home Town, and once a Duck always a Duck.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby Conor Dary » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:32 am

gh wrote:The IAAF has some decidedly "palatial" real estate in Monaco (is there any other kind there?).

Having said that, it should be noted that all of the positions of power in the IAAF (President, Council, etc.) come sans salary. Although the "IAAF Family" is clearly treated well whilst on the road.


If I remember Primo got tired of the UK press....so off to Monaco.
Conor Dary
 
Posts: 6297
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: कनोर दारी in Ronald MacDonald's Home Town, and once a Duck always a Duck.

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:33 am

Revenue numbers mean nothing without the corresponding expense numbers.

But I certainly won't be holding my breath waiting to see the IAAF's books!
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby gh » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:34 am

Conor Dary wrote:
gh wrote:The IAAF has some decidedly "palatial" real estate in Monaco (is there any other kind there?).

Having said that, it should be noted that all of the positions of power in the IAAF (President, Council, etc.) come sans salary. Although the "IAAF Family" is clearly treated well whilst on the road.


If I remember Primo got tired of the UK press....so off to Monaco.


Press had nothing to do with it. Try Monaco's tax structure. (and also breaking up the British hegemony)
gh
 
Posts: 46294
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:31 am
Location: firmly at Arya's side!

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby EPelle » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:40 am

ESPN wrote:(IAAF) receives $35.77 million from the 2012 London Games. That's up from the $29 million the IAAF received from the 2008 Beijing Games.

With the increased Olympic revenue, the IAAF expects its income through 2012 to be $204 million with expenditures of $203 million.

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/trackandf ... id=5229874
EPelle
 
Posts: 21442
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby guru » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:48 am

EPelle wrote:
ESPN wrote:(IAAF) receives $35.77 million from the 2012 London Games. That's up from the $29 million the IAAF received from the 2008 Beijing Games.

With the increased Olympic revenue, the IAAF expects its income through 2012 to be $204 million with expenditures of $203 million.

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/trackandf ... id=5229874



Worth noting those numbers are from 2010, and since they're from the IAAF, you can bet they're long on the expenditure side, and short on revenue(even at $200 million!)
guru
 
Posts: 10265
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: Strava, racking KOMs https://tinyurl.com/qf2ntch

Re: T&F Athletes To Unionize

Postby mump boy » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:56 am

gh wrote:
MJR wrote:....

GH- You're thinking Marketing in the in the Macroeconomics sense, not marketing in the microeconomics sense. This will not make T&F a big sport, but it will allow the industrious athletes & clubs the ability to fund themselves from local sources and have a greater ability to give back to those sponsors in exchange for funding. Its not about butting heads with meet directors, but making connections with regional companies that may treat the athlete with enough celebrity to fund their training in exchange for PR work, etc.


Sorry, color me a cynic, but looking at the TFAA roster and the big-namers who are signing on, I can't imagine any of them thinking about the sport at the club level. Nor do I think that "funding at the local level" is remotely on the agenda. This remains, I fear, about the big/almost-big names being able to increase their earnings, not some grand social plan by which every hopeful gets a piece of some perhaps-not-there pie. This is the problem I have with the whole concept.


100% agree

this whole "we demand change' thing had NOTHING to do with local sponsors being given the change to support local athletes, It was ALL about Nike not having the Olympic contract.

Do you honestly think Sanya etc is going to go on strike so a race walker can get sponsored by her local pizza place ?
mump boy
 
Posts: 5636
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 4:32 am
Location: saaaaaarf london

PreviousNext

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Gabriella, Google [Bot], MSNbot Media, Speedster and 13 guests