Rudisha loses...Eaton AOY?? [or Merritt?!]

[gibson]

when you look at the above list, you have to say,
it has been a great year for track and field.

[croflash]

when you look at the above list, you have to say,
it has been a great year for track and field.

Mainly track though. Some field events have been rather underwhelming this season.

[bobguild76]

An additional thought regarding AOY ... Barring his disappointing Bronze medal at the Olympics, Reese Hoffa has been quite dominating in the SP. Yes, the bronze is a fair sized blemish (compared to other AOY contenders) on his 2012 record, but he has met the top competition even more than the 110 hurdlers, and has been stellar otherwise.

Honors won - B at OG, DL winner in SP w/ double the points of the runner-up, Majewski,
Won/Loss record - One loss to Majewski & Storl, Perfect (I think) vs everyone else,
Sequence of marks - consistent 21 meter throws. Cantwell has the yearly lead, but Hoffa has the high end consistency.

Easily the top SP, and # 9 or 10 in AOY.

I don't see how someone with OG bronze and other loses gets ranked unless he's done something else outstanding performance wise

Rudisha
Merrit
Eaton
Bolt
Harting
Farah
Lavellenie
Blake
James
Ukhov
A Walker (i have no idea)


must all come before Hoffa

Excellent point. "... and other losses" For me, that's the key. Other than his WIC 4th place, does Hoffa have any other losses? And, will the WIC count in the AOY balloting? If so, he's out. Number one in the SP, but not enough to crack the AOY Top 10.

We must also consider that James & Ukhov have losses on their resume outside the OG. Apart from the OG, Hoffa would be ranked far higher than James or Ukhov. The question then is, How far does the OG Bronze pull Hoffa down - vis a vis James & Ukhov - when it comes to AOY rankings?

[gh]

A...
Won/Loss record - One loss to Majewski & Storl, Perfect (I think) vs everyone else.

Not quite.
8-3 w/ Majewski
3-3 w/ Storl
10-1 w/ Whiting
8-1 w/ Cantwell
4-1 w/ Nelson

[dbirds]

dbirds wrote:
The question is: how do you rank a false start? On paper, it's last place but really it's not. Thoughts??

How could it be anything but last place? 7 guys crossed the line ahead of you, and it's your fault you weren't there, not theirs.

On paper, it is an 8th place finish but not in everyone's heads. A FS is not the same as finishing last. If Merritt had 2 last place losses, he would not be in contention for AOY.

[EPelle]

Either way, he failed to win a race he started.

[kuha]

How could it be anything but last place? 7 guys crossed the line ahead of you, and it's your fault you weren't there, not theirs.

I just don't see this. A false start ends up being a DNS, or at very worst, a DNF--vastly different from 8th place.

[gh]

...
Same this year. Merritt's 12.80 puts a sharp tip on the finest hurdling season since Hot-Rod Milburn took AOY in 1971. (Slightly better than Skeets in 1981.) According to the Jan 1972 AOY edition of T&FN (page 4), Milburn's AAU semi-final in 1971 was auto-timed in 12.94. gh, could you correct me if that has changed? ...

That's an artifact from the days when people tended to coinflate 100th-second timing with "automatic." It was not. That's a hand-time taken off a Datatimer, which is probably worse than regular hand timing because the same person isn't starting and stopping the clock.

[bobguild76]

A...
Won/Loss record - One loss to Majewski & Storl, Perfect (I think) vs everyone else.

Not quite.
8-3 w/ Majewski
3-3 w/ Storl
10-1 w/ Whiting
8-1 w/ Cantwell
4-1 w/ Nelson

Thanks gh! I just moved back from South Africa and didn't have my T&FN's to double check. Talk about feeling naked & unprepared! In that case, Hoffa doesn't merit consideration for the Top 10.

Thanks also for the update regarding Rod Milburn's 13.0h from 1971. In those days, we always added .14 (or was it .24?) to the hand timed to equal an auto time. Therefore, a 13.0h would translate to a 13.14 (or a 13.24), not a 12.94.

[aaronk]

IF...IF Merritt should be chosen the AOY, I hope T&FN does NOT headline the article.....

"Aries Merritt's AOY"!!

[iggy]

I wanted to post first. and then read! so i apologize if someone has already noted similarly.

I will say Merritt for AOY simple because of his season as a whole. The most sub 13 races clocked in a single season by one individual in hurdle history and to conclude it with a WR of 12.80!!!! WOW!
I would award Eaton for POY, PERFORMANCE of the year at the USA OTs! 10.20 and then 27ft minutes later.then having to PR by 4 seconds i believe in the 1500 for the WR.... just GREAT!

And as for Rudisha, despite his loss (i mean, damn, the dude is tired, he is human! cant knock him on that) he is a TIGHT second for best performance of the year. The guy not only dropped the WR to 1.40 but he lead the ENTIRE field to PRs and NRs!

[croflash]

How could it be anything but last place? 7 guys crossed the line ahead of you, and it's your fault you weren't there, not theirs.

I just don't see this. A false start ends up being a DNS, or at very worst, a DNF--vastly different from 8th place.

It is different because a false start is worse than finishing in last place. If someone has a false start, I don't see how that can be considered a DNS when he was physically present at the start line. It is like a false attempt for a field eventer, except that you only get one chance as a runner. Projecting a result based on the past is fine, but the athlete needs to prove it every single time. Everything else is speculation based on probabilities.

[Dave]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

This year is an embarrassment of riches for a men's perspective.

[tandfman]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

I doubt that it means anything more than that it was a picture of the most important race that occurred in the period between the publication of the last issue and the publication of this one.

[gh]

since the ballot haven't even gone out to the voters yet, it's indicative of nothing in the AOY department.

If we knew that he was the AOY we'd probably be LESS likely to use him now than moreso.

[ATK]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

Means he had a post Olympic performance, worthy of the cover.

[Dave]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

Means he had a post Olympic performance, worthy of the cover.

An embarrassment of riches this year.....

[br]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

Means he had a post Olympic performance, worthy of the cover.

An embarrassment of riches this year.....

If not Merritt, who would your choice have been for the November issue?

[mump boy]

So the IAAF finalists are in

Usain Bolt
Aries Merrit
David Rusdisha

http://www.iaaf.org/news/press-release/ ... -mens-fina

[Dave]

hmm. Merritt is on this months cover. I wonder if that means he is going to be AOY?

Means he had a post Olympic performance, worthy of the cover.

An embarrassment of riches this year.....

If not Merritt, who would your choice have been for the November issue?

No idea. I had no issue with him being on the cover, I just thought it might portend being the AOY. Looks like it portends nothing.

[Dave]

So the IAAF finalists are in

Usain Bolt
Aries Merrit
David Rusdisha

http://www.iaaf.org/news/press-release/ ... -mens-fina

Wow. Merrit and Rudisha are obvious. I do think they are missing someone here....



[spelling correction]

[j-a-m]

Wow. Merrit and Rudish are obvious. I do think they are missing someone here....

Yeah, not sure what the IAAF criteria are, maybe they don't take WRs in multi events into consideration ...

[toyracer]

It seems to me that Bolt's name is there simply because he's Bolt. In my opinion Bolt doesn't deserve consideration over Eaton. Bolt lost, twice. No individual world record.

In any case, I'm pulling for Merritt.

[Tuariki]

It seems to me that Bolt's name is there simply because he's Bolt. In my opinion Bolt doesn't deserve consideration over Eaton. Bolt lost, twice. No individual world record.

In any case, I'm pulling for Merritt.

Unfortunately, I think Eaton suffers from a lack of performances which is always a problem for athletes in the multi events, as it is for those in the marathon.

Bolt had a pretty good year, 3 x gold, 1 x OR(ind), 1 x WR (team), 1 x OR team; 2nd fastest 100 in history; 4th= fastest 200 in history.

Eaton has 1 x gold; 1 x WR (ind); plus 8th best performance in history and no OR.

Against Eaton I think Bolt is ahead.

I think Merrit should be AOY. Rudisha #2, Bolt #3, Eaton #4.

I think Mo Farah is #5.

[Daisy]

I think Mo Farah is #5.

But given the immense pressure he was under......

[Tuariki]

I think Mo Farah is #5.

But given the immense pressure he was under......

True that - he had double the immense what with relatives traversing the desert sands of the horn of Africa to watch it on the nearest TV

[nianchengyu]

Eaton is even not in the top3, huge unfair foe him,who else can break hep and dec in the same season?

[ZELLGADISS]

Bolt will win AOY.
One thing that i dont understand is that for some people is more important to get WR(although the old WR is not super great)that 2nd best time in history(9.63 Bolt)when the WR is super great.

I know points IAAF for each event, and 9.63 is very very far of times in other events.
9.63 is around 1.39.61 in 800m and 12.57 in 110 hurdles(iaaf tables 2011, now it would be almost same i imagine).
It means that the WR in 100 for Bolt is very near of human limit while the other events are far yet.

So this my point of view, WR because is WR not mean that is better that other time in other event being wonderful time.

Regards

[26mi235]

Bolt will win AOY.
One thing that i dont understand is that for some people is more important to get WR(although the old WR is not super great)that 2nd best time in history(9.63 Bolt)when the WR is super great.

I know points IAAF for each event, and 9.63 is very very far of times in other events.
9.63 is around 1.39.61 in 800m and 12.57 in 110 hurdles(iaaf tables 2011, now it would be almost same i imagine).
It means that the WR in 100 for Bolt is very near of human limit while the other events are far yet.

So this my point of view, WR because is WR not mean that is better that other time in other event being wonderful time.

Regards

Well, that 9.63 is the same as a 12.57 110h tells us more about the shortcomings of the IAAF tables than it does about the relative merit of the performance levels. I suspect those with a lot of knowledge of the events would likely be of the same opinion. I expect to never see a 12.57, which is about 0.3 fast than the prior WR while several others have already run 9.6x. And, it almost certainly is at best Bolt's third best 100m, as I doubt that this effort was better than his last Olympic victory.

[ZELLGADISS]

26mi235, the 110 hurdles was very stopped, with no really sprinters in this event(yes i know that is hurdles too).
But only 0.06 improvement in 30 years¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡
Really very few improvement, int this moment the hurdles should to be sub 12.7 sure.

5 years ago only, in 100 was almost impossible to get sub 9.8, and now Bolt gets more or less easy and sub 9.6 too. It is amazing.
And in big championship almost nobody to gets sub 9.8, and Bolt make it very very easy.

I think that the people should to understand that a great time when WR is super great is better that a WR where the old WR is not super great.

It is a big difference, a WR because is WR is not always better that other wonderful time in other event.

Regards

[ATK]

Bolt will win AOY.

If he does, it wont be because of his performances during the year, it will be because of his name...

[ZELLGADISS]

Bolt will win AOY.

If he does, it wont be because of his performances during the year, it will be because of his name...

That is YOUR opinion.
In my opinion NO.
NAME?
3 golds in OG by 2nd time consecutive, it is name?(Nobody made it before)
olympic record in 100m, it is name?
The best time in the history in 200m too for somebody not called BOLT in a big championship(tied with Johnson, although Bolt made it jogging last 10m).
WR in 4x100m
Champion undefeteaded in Diamond in 100m(in 200 he won all his races in diamond too).

The hightest points IAAF(IAAF TABLES) in all events with BIG difference.

Is it NAME?

Yes, sure that he will win because he is called BOLT.
Sometimes looks that some people is blind ...

[bushop]

Bolt will win AOY.

If he does, it wont be because of his performances during the year, it will be because of his name...

That is YOUR opinion.

Of course it is... whose else would they be?

3 golds in OG

Two individual

2nd time consecutive,

Shouldn't matter

WR in 4x100m

Shouldn't matter.

[ZELLGADISS]

bushop for you ALL it no counts.
For who votes YES counts.
So probably he will win

The performances this year for Bolt are enought for to win again.
I dont understand so many haters for Bolt.
Bolt got some incredible this year.

[ATK]

bushop for you ALL it no counts.
For who votes YES counts.
So probably he will win

The performances this year for Bolt are enought for to win again.
I dont understand so many haters for Bolt.
Bolt got some incredible this year.

Compared to Rudisha, Merrit and Eaton(considering the event he is in) his year was just pretty good.