For me setting a WR, in a non sprint event, in an Olympic final, tops any other kind of achievement in Track and Field and more than compensates for one end of sea on loss. If Eaton had competed and won another time, or if we could could include indoor Hep in our consideration, it may be a closer run thing but as it is Rudisha for me.
Eaton
Can't choose between
Merrit Harting Bolt
at the moment
Farah but he could easily be demoted as his season outside of OG is very thin
So without looking anyone up, Taylor, Lavillenie and James and Pars come into play. Actually looking at that lot Mo is safe in 6th but deffo won't go any higher
I'm going for Rudisha as AOY too. I'm not going to hold his defeat to Aman against him when comparing Rudisha to Eaton simply because of the nature of the events. If he'd had 3-4 losses on the circuit, then I'd give the nod to Eaton but one loss doesn't blemish his 2012 record when he's competed frequently compared to Eaton's two.
To win it as a multi-eventer (or as a marathon/walks specialist), I think every performance has to be of a hugely distinguished standard. Eaton's victory in London was fantastic but it wasn't an Olympic record and he was somewhat down on his best in a few events. Had he achieved an OR or gone over 8900 for the best ever mark in a championships, then the balance would probably tip in Eaton's favour. Instead, his performance was the ninth best ever, while Rudisha has produced a WR and the eighth fastest time ever (and the twelfth).
Both great athletes but Rudisha nabs it this year.
mump boy wrote: Can't choose between
Merrit Harting Bolt
I'd probably put Merritt just below the other two. He lost two early-season races (fourth in Shanghai, second in Eugene) and had two DQs (New York and Lausanne). I'm assuming the DQs count as losses to the people judging it?
nevetsllim wrote:I'm going for Rudisha as AOY too. I'm not going to hold his defeat to Aman against him when comparing Rudisha to Eaton simply because of the nature of the events. If he'd had 3-4 losses on the circuit, then I'd give the nod to Eaton but one loss doesn't blemish his 2012 record when he's competed frequently compared to Eaton's two.
To win it as a multi-eventer (or as a marathon/walks specialist), I think every performance has to be of a hugely distinguished standard. Eaton's victory in London was fantastic but it wasn't an Olympic record and he was somewhat down on his best in a few events. Had he achieved an OR or gone over 8900 for the best ever mark in a championships, then the balance would probably tip in Eaton's favour. Instead, his performance was the ninth best ever, while Rudisha has produced a WR and the eighth fastest time ever (and the twelfth).
Both great athletes but Rudisha nabs it this year.
mump boy wrote: Can't choose between
Merrit Harting Bolt
I'd probably put Merritt just below the other two. He lost two early-season races (fourth in Shanghai, second in Eugene) and had two DQs (New York and Lausanne). I'm assuming the DQs count as losses to the people judging it?
I know marks aren't supposed to count for much but the quality of his races is far superior to the others
12.96w (2) Eugene 12.93 (1) OT 12.93 (1) London 12.93 (1) Monaco 12.94 (1) OG Semi 12.92 (1) OG 12.95 (1) Birmingham 12.97 (1) Berlin
this kind of consistency and ubiquity is worth more than a couple of loses
Tuariki wrote:IMO as it stands today it is Rudisha, then Eaton as: 1. I rate Rudisha's WR performance higher than Eaton's 2. Rudisha's number of wins with quality performances 3. It is not that difficult to go undefeated if you only compete twice
The only athlete that could upset that scenario is Merritt. IMO if he can break the WR then he would go to the top for AOY.
As I am no longer a politician then I am no longer allowed to be a hypocrite. And so 12.80 does it for me. #1 Merrit #2 Rudisha #3 Eaton
Tuariki wrote:IMO as it stands today it is Rudisha, then Eaton as: 1. I rate Rudisha's WR performance higher than Eaton's 2. Rudisha's number of wins with quality performances 3. It is not that difficult to go undefeated if you only compete twice
The only athlete that could upset that scenario is Merritt. IMO if he can break the WR then he would go to the top for AOY.
As I am no longer a politician then I am no longer allowed to be a hypocrite. And so 12.80 does it for me. #1 Merrit #2 Rudisha #3 Eaton
dbirds wrote:The question is: how do you rank a false start? On paper, it's last place but really it's not. Thoughts??
Depends on the specifics. Merritt, when he false started recently, risked a lot because he wanted to get the WR. Had he run "only" to win, he'd risked less and won. Based on that specific explanation, I wouldn't count it against him.
Once you talk about top 5, I believe Lavillenie should be included in the conversation. I've got him at #5, behind Bolt, and just ahead of Harting and Farah.
j-a-m wrote:Once you talk about top 5, I believe Lavillenie should be included in the conversation. I've got him at #5, behind Bolt, and just ahead of Harting and Farah.
There is NO WAY Lavillenie is ahead of Harting but i'd be happy to see loads of other people ahead of Mo though.
Last edited by mump boy on Sat Sep 08, 2012 2:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
It's a toss up for #5 for me between Mo and Usain for 5th. Mo hardly competed but Usain ducked his biggest competitor unless he had no choice.
I'm also vaguely wavering on Merritt. His 2 DQ's technically count as loses so that's 4 he had during the year. Does that outweigh his other other accomplishments when he has such strong opposition?
j-a-m wrote:Once you talk about top 5, I believe Lavillenie should be included in the conversation. I've got him at #5, behind Bolt, and just ahead of Harting and Farah.
Lavillenie is in my mix for 5th along with Farah and Bolt but Harting has to be ahead of all the others.
It's a toss up for #5 for me between Mo and Usain for 5th. Mo hardly competed but Usain ducked his biggest competitor unless he had no choice.
Are you drunk ? he may have ducked Blake (and visa versa) but who was Mo racing against at the Euro Champs, the heats of the UK champs, a contrived 2 mile race won in 8.23 or was that 5k against Collis Birmingham the high quality competition you're looking for ??
Usain's Season
100m 05.05 Kingston Jamaica International Invitational 1. 9.82 100m 25.05 Ostrava Golden Spike 1. 10.04 100m 31.05 Roma Golden Gala 1. 9.76 100m 07.06 Oslo ExxonMobil Bislett Games 1. 9.79 100m 29.06 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 9.86 200m 01.07 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 19.83 100m 05.08 London Olympic Games 1. 9.63 200m 09.08 London Olympic Games 1. 19.32 4x100m 11.08 London Olympic Games 1. 36.84 200m 23.08 Lausanne Athletissima 1. 19.58 200m 30.08 Zürich Weltklasse 1. 19.66 100m 07.09 Bruxelles Memorial Van Damme 1. 9.86
These massively superior marks certainly make up for the couple of losses
Where's Bolt ? and i wouldn't mind Blake before Farah as well
Blake??? Who couldn't even win an individual Gold Medal? against someone who won 2???
Against the highest quality competition with a series of times right up there on the all time list. I think his series of races is far superior to Mo, even if he came 2nd
mump boy wrote:Are you drunk ? he may have ducked Blake (and visa versa) but who was Mo racing against at the Euro Champs, the heats of the UK champs, a contrived 2 mile race won in 8.23 or was that 5k against Collis Birmingham the high quality competition you're looking for ??
Usain's Season
100m 05.05 Kingston Jamaica International Invitational 1. 9.82 100m 25.05 Ostrava Golden Spike 1. 10.04 100m 31.05 Roma Golden Gala 1. 9.76 100m 07.06 Oslo ExxonMobil Bislett Games 1. 9.79 100m 29.06 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 9.86 200m 01.07 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 19.83 100m 05.08 London Olympic Games 1. 9.63 200m 09.08 London Olympic Games 1. 19.32 4x100m 11.08 London Olympic Games 1. 36.84 200m 23.08 Lausanne Athletissima 1. 19.58 200m 30.08 Zürich Weltklasse 1. 19.66 100m 07.09 Bruxelles Memorial Van Damme 1. 9.86
These massively superior marks certainly make up for the couple of losses
mump boy wrote:Are you drunk ? he may have ducked Blake (and visa versa) but who was Mo racing against at the Euro Champs, the heats of the UK champs, a contrived 2 mile race won in 8.23 or was that 5k against Collis Birmingham the high quality competition you're looking for ??
Usain's Season
100m 05.05 Kingston Jamaica International Invitational 1. 9.82 100m 25.05 Ostrava Golden Spike 1. 10.04 100m 31.05 Roma Golden Gala 1. 9.76 100m 07.06 Oslo ExxonMobil Bislett Games 1. 9.79 100m 29.06 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 9.86 200m 01.07 Kingston Jamaican Ch. 2. 19.83 100m 05.08 London Olympic Games 1. 9.63 200m 09.08 London Olympic Games 1. 19.32 4x100m 11.08 London Olympic Games 1. 36.84 200m 23.08 Lausanne Athletissima 1. 19.58 200m 30.08 Zürich Weltklasse 1. 19.66 100m 07.09 Bruxelles Memorial Van Damme 1. 9.86
These massively superior marks certainly make up for the couple of losses
Updating an earlier post, adding stats for Merritt's WR and current season:
WR superiority to 2nd best performer ever: Rudisha: 0.20% Eaton: 0.14% Merritt: 0.55%
WR superiority to average of next 5 best performers ever: Rudisha 0.80% Eaton 1.36% Merritt 0.70%
WR superiority to average of next 10 best performers ever: Rudisha 1.15% Eaton 2.02% Merritt 0.87%
WR superiority to average of next 5 best PERFORMANCES ever: Rudisha 0.59% Eaton 1.07% Merritt 0.66% (Note: Performances by someone other than Rudisha/Eaton/Merritt)
WR superiority to average of next 10 best Performances ever: Rudisha 0.86% Eaton 1.60% Merritt 0.76%
# of next 10 best performers beaten this year: Rudisha: 5 (#4 Amos, #6 Kaki, #9 Borzakovsky, #10 Kitum, #11 Aman) Eaton: 3 (#2 Sebrle, #7 Clay, #10 Hardee) Merritt: 4 (#2 Robles, #3 Liu, #4 Oliver, #11 Trammell)
# of top 10 performances all time Rudisha/Eaton/Merritt have in 2012, excluding their previous years' results Rudisha 3 (#1, #4, #8) Eaton 2 (#1, #8) Merritt 1 (#1)
