tracknut2012 wrote:Jamaica is the sprint capital of the world.
Sorry but I still have it as this USA- 3 golds, 5 silver, 4 bronze Jam- 3 golds, 3 silver, 3 bronze
And then theres the 4x4 and 4x1. Basically your statement does not make sense. How can it be the sprint capital if another country has more sprint medals and a better overall sprint coverage?
Somebody forgot to tell you the sprint capital is defined as 100/200m and the mens 4 x 100m
As a non USA and non Jamaica I reckon it is all about individual winners over 100m and 200m.
Result Jamaica - 3 Gold, USA 1 Gold.
The great unwashed public does not care about silver or bronze.
Marlow wrote:OK, here's my outrageous post of the day:
Does anyone beside me think that Blake under-performed (somewhat significantly)?
Yes, his 19.26 was a one-off last year, but hasn't everything this year indicated he is faster AND stronger? How does he 'only' run 19.44 (yes, I realize how STOOPID that sounds)?
[This is just my sour grapes for having picked him in the Prediction contests!]
BOLT SMOKED THE TURN AND I THINK BLAKE MAY HAVE TIGHTENED UP A BIT.
t_monk wrote:Adding the 400... It's still in the favor of JA....
Yeah, but if/when you add the 400 you also need to add the 4x400, and that changes things a bit.
Counting individual events along no.... Counting the relays...It would be difficult to do because to be frank... sh!t happens.... US can win all 4 relays or none depending on what happens on the day with the stick.
Marlow wrote:OK, here's my outrageous post of the day:
Does anyone beside me think that Blake under-performed (somewhat significantly)?
Yes, his 19.26 was a one-off last year, but hasn't everything this year indicated he is faster AND stronger? How does he 'only' run 19.44 (yes, I realize how STOOPID that sounds)?
[This is just my sour grapes for having picked him in the Prediction contests!]
Not so much in the 200 but in the 100 I agree with you. Maybe too much was expected from Blake after last season. The 100 tells me that low 9.6 is "another country" inhabited only by Bolt.
Is it possible that we just underestimate a 9.70 because of Bolt? Yes, I had thought Blake would be around 9.70 by now.
BOLT SMOKED THE TURN AND I THINK BLAKE MAY HAVE TIGHTENED UP A BIT.
Perceptions are a bitch: Yer repeating the mantra from the TV Commentary (Not just NBC, wasn't someone else claiming that?). If gaining on Bolt in the stretch--his forte, and he wasn't exactly coasting, just maintaining form--while not exhibiting any of the classic signs of tying up, like shortened stride, lower knee lift, arms flailing, is "tying up", I don't know what that means.
Let's see if Ato Bolton, who personally knows both sides, has to say in a few minutes (West Coast time here). I'd like to hear more, from Bolt and analysts, of how much faster he could've run today if winning Gold wasn't paramount.
It was stated somewhere here that he'd been "sick". He looked both spooked and pallid at the start, but again, I don't like to get into that level of speculation until someone else raises a question. As I affirmed earlier, when someone claimed "Lane 2 is better", it was his bete noire today. I insist he'd have done better from Lane 9, starting with knowing that and maybe not being so dejected at the start (speculation).
Haven't read whole thread but... What was Bolt doing at end of race? Making his "shh" gesture? If he had run through tape he would have broken his OR (as he did in the 100).
Last year I had real questions about Bolt, with the biggest aspect being the unreliability of his start, especially under pressure. While I did not post it here I thought it very possible that he would false start in the 100 and said so 'off line' to a Jamaican poster here.
This year there was a period where things were uncertain with him physically. But once that cleared up I did not think that there was too much question about him in either the 100 or 200 and that Blake was a bit better but on the same level as Gay and Gatlin in the 100 and better than Spearmon in the 200 (but Blake has a great but thin 200 resume).
As for sprint dominance, despite the disaster for the US in the 400, of the sprints 30 plus 4 medals that you can win, I do not think that Jamaica will be ahead of the US at the end of the day. If you add the other 'speed' events of the LJ/TJ, the tally becomes even more lopsided and clearly the Deca (and Hept) has some sprint dominance as well. The Jamaican squad was particularly weak (for them) in anything of 201m or more, where 60% of the individual sprint medals are.
Another awesome performance by Bolt and Blake. Brilliant stuff.
Full respect to Wallace Spearman. He did well, though I was hoping he'd show something better. Seems that Wally may be carrying a little nick in his lower legs, as he always has the tape on.
Also disappointed with Lemaitre. He did not look himself. Granted lane 2 tough, but not that tough. He seemed way off his game. Not sure what was up. Thought for sure Lemaitre was good for the Bronze and a 19.70 - 19.80 type performance. Maybe he was sick or something?
Lemaitre has poor control over his arms which you need for counterbalancing hip rotations and you need them even more when running on the curve, especially a tight curve. He has huge untapped potential. I wish he could train under Tellez or Smith who know how to clean this up.
zidan wrote:Apart from a nauseous feeling, there is nothing else to obtain from this US vs Jamaica sprint capital of the world 'thing'. It's like the Allies saying we won WW two (Not important) Jamaica has overachieved with their size and resources, while the US has been the greatest sprint nation ever, whether we talking the 100m only or events up to the 400m. So let's just enjoy the thrill that greats are giving us now while it last! ( By the way am a born Jamaican)
I'll say something else about this. Anyone who tears Bolt down or belittles his accomplishments or expresses disappointment because he is not an American is not a track and field fan, at least as I understand the concept. Track and field, at the elite level, is not about waving the flag and proving your patriotism. It's about who's the best and how fast did they run / far did they jump or throw.
Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field. This guy is nothing short of the face of our sport. This is a great moment to be a track and field fan and to see this man do these things. Nationalism, when it blinds one to greatness, is ugly.
Not trying to piggy back Carl here(obv jealousy), BUT...."something is in the water" down there! Not only Jamaica has had good times, but other "south" countries, and they all train together! USA(having it's own problems) have been on major alert since many failed test, and suspect results of "some" athletes**cough** Johnson***cough***! Testing should be UNIVERSAL...not just the US.
Usain is tall, but come on! Under this "LOGIC",Bailey should stop trying to run like a 5'10" runner and start using his height, and maybe he can run 9.6?? or 19.?? !
Last edited by merriwx70 on Fri Aug 10, 2012 1:27 am, edited 3 times in total.
MDelano wrote:Lemaitre has poor control over his arms which you need for counterbalancing hip rotations and you need them even more when running on the curve, especially a tight curve. He has huge untapped potential. I wish he could train under Tellez or Smith who know how to clean this up.
I must complement you on your post here and your posts overall - uniformly of high quality/good insight and with a minimum of negativity.
Pelpa wrote:Well on the note of sprint capital, despite USA being firmly and unequivocally the sprint capital of the world, Jamaica has managed to produce brand new sprint talent in their first Olympics winning medals: Parchment, Blake*, Weir and we are watching Bailey Cole** to complement other sprint medals they have already won.
Don't forget Jason Young also from Racers Track Club who has run 19.86 this year in the 200m.
Grazerism wrote:Haven't read whole thread but... What was Bolt doing at end of race? Making his "shh" gesture? If he had run through tape he would have broken his OR (as he did in the 100).
That might've been directed at the likes of Carl Lewis....
I'll say something else about this. Anyone who tears Bolt down or belittles his accomplishments or expresses disappointment because he is not an American is not a track and field fan, at least as I understand the concept. Track and field, at the elite level, is not about waving the flag and proving your patriotism. It's about who's the best and how fast did they run / far did they jump or throw.
Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field. This guy is nothing short of the face of our sport. This is a great moment to be a track and field fan and to see this man do these things. Nationalism, when it blinds one to greatness, is ugly.[/quote]
zidan wrote:Apart from a nauseous feeling, there is nothing else to obtain from this US vs Jamaica sprint capital of the world 'thing'. It's like the Allies saying we won WW two (Not important) Jamaica has overachieved with their size and resources, while the US has been the greatest sprint nation ever, whether we talking the 100m only or events up to the 400m. So let's just enjoy the thrill that greats are giving us now while it last! ( By the way am a born Jamaican)
I'll say something else about this. Anyone who tears Bolt down or belittles his accomplishments or expresses disappointment because he is not an American is not a track and field fan, at least as I understand the concept. Track and field, at the elite level, is not about waving the flag and proving your patriotism. It's about who's the best and how fast did they run / far did they jump or throw.
Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field. This guy is nothing short of the face of our sport. This is a great moment to be a track and field fan and to see this man do these things. Nationalism, when it blinds one to greatness, is ugly.
zidan wrote:Apart from a nauseous feeling, there is nothing else to obtain from this US vs Jamaica sprint capital of the world 'thing'. It's like the Allies saying we won WW two (Not important) Jamaica has overachieved with their size and resources, while the US has been the greatest sprint nation ever, whether we talking the 100m only or events up to the 400m. So let's just enjoy the thrill that greats are giving us now while it last! ( By the way am a born Jamaican)
I'll say something else about this. Anyone who tears Bolt down or belittles his accomplishments or expresses disappointment because he is not an American is not a track and field fan, at least as I understand the concept. Track and field, at the elite level, is not about waving the flag and proving your patriotism. It's about who's the best and how fast did they run / far did they jump or throw.
Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field. This guy is nothing short of the face of our sport. This is a great moment to be a track and field fan and to see this man do these things. Nationalism, when it blinds one to greatness, is ugly.
Well said Dilan esper!!!
You have said it right and we will all be happy when Carl Lewis stops talking classic suggestive comments; Bolt said he had no respect for Lewis during his press thingy after the event and can you blame him, especially after a certain Olympics.
lionelp1 wrote:I'll say something else about this. Anyone who tears Bolt down or belittles his accomplishments or expresses disappointment because he is not an American is not a track and field fan, at least as I understand the concept. Track and field, at the elite level, is not about waving the flag and proving your patriotism. It's about who's the best and how fast did they run / far did they jump or throw.
Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field. This guy is nothing short of the face of our sport. This is a great moment to be a track and field fan and to see this man do these things. Nationalism, when it blinds one to greatness, is ugly.
[/quote] Trying to tear down doubt is what killed Carl! Before you proclaim Bolt "The Greatest"....be aware Canadians said the same thing, and even people about Johnson, Flo-Jo, and even Carl himself. This has been a "iffy" topic over the years when it comes to records. Johnson ran a compact style for the whole 400(that caused doubt of EPO), and Carl was accused for years after Roy Martin...this comes with the records, and because he is smashing them in "Flo-Jo" fashion people want to see a uniform testing system. Don't be blind or try to belittle us with "lack of track support", because his records and times seem suspect. At this rate he could run a 42.?? 400m. 9.63(this Olympics) + 19.32(coasting) + his height = 42.?? easy!!!!
Dilan Esper wrote:Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field.
Agreed. As a real sports fan, you wanna see athletes from your country compete against the best in the world; and if the best are even better than those from your country, that's fine. And it's great to see how athletes have become role models in Jamaica and other Caribbean countries.
Dilan Esper wrote:Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field.
Agreed. As a real sports fan, you wanna see athletes from your country compete against the best in the world; and if the best are even better than those from your country, that's fine. And it's great to see how athletes have become role models in Jamaica and other Caribbean countries.
I'ts funny how none of this ,"so called"..."real sports fan enthusiasm", was around when R.Jacobs, M.Johnson, J.Gatlin, or G.Devers was setting records, but we are to just turn a blind eye when ALL runners for "southern" or Caribbean countries are setting PB's from 16-30ys old????
Maybe the U.S can get some of that "Water" from down there!
The JAMS have progressed rather quickly. The 3rd place WEIR went from 20.43 last year this time to 19.8 !!! We need that coach here for some of our athletes
I agree with previous poster that it appears Lemaitre needs better coaching. He seems technically underdeveloped and under trained. It would be interesting to see what Lemaitre could do under a coach like Smith. Lemaitre's arms are kind of a mess. Also, it seems his weight training may not be intense enough. He needs to get stronger in the weight room. More power and better mechanics and CL can go into the 9.8s and 19.60s. He's talented enough. He's proven himself to be one of the big boys, but needs to step it up another level. Then again, he's only 22, so his best years should be ahead of him.
Him being still just 25 years old (soon to be 26!!), it's amazing to me to realize that Usain Bolt has been around so long!! But his first Track and Field News cover was in the September 2003 issue!!! NINE years ago!!!
I don't mind a bit of doping speculation (I engage in it myself from time to time) although I would note it is generally against this forum's rules.
But NATIONALISTIC doping speculation seems pretty far off to me. Jamaica isn't East Germany, and even in the "glory" days of East Germany plenty of Americans were doping too, although it wasn't state sanctioned and systematic like it was over there.
At any rate, under the testing protocols we have now, the Jamaicans are clean and their performances are legit. If someone comes forward with evidence in the future, we can (and I am sure will) discuss it. Until then, the Jamaicans are passing the same drug tests the Americans are passing, and their sprinters are running faster. And Usain Bolt is doing things that none of us dreamt possible.
Plus, he's got a great personality, a marketable image, a desire to come back and compete at Rio, and incredible media savvy. He's just great for our sport. Don't ruin this with utter speculation about things that there is no evidence for, and especially without holding American athletes to the same standards.
lilwayne1814 wrote:The JAMS have progressed rather quickly. The 3rd place WEIR went from 20.43 last year this time to 19.8 !!! We need that coach here for some of our athletes
Judging from the name I am judging that you are young and not too bright right?
lilwayne1814 wrote:The JAMS have progressed rather quickly. The 3rd place WEIR went from 20.43 last year this time to 19.8 !!! We need that coach here for some of our athletes
I seem to remember a certain Wariner in 2004 won the OG in a 44 seconds dead and the previous year his best was 45.13...an improvement of 1.13 secs; when this extreme improvement happened and was challenged we heard a lot from the US about talent and young guys can make enormous improvements with great coaching in order to rationalise the sudden improvement;;; other athletes from other countries can do the same.... well done, Weir.
lilwayne1814 wrote:The JAMS have progressed rather quickly. The 3rd place WEIR went from 20.43 last year this time to 19.8 !!! We need that coach here for some of our athletes
Judging from the name I am judging that you are young and not too bright right?
Dilan Esper wrote:Usain Bolt, and the rise of Jamaica as a sprinting power, has been great for track and field.
Agreed. As a real sports fan, you wanna see athletes from your country compete against the best in the world; and if the best are even better than those from your country, that's fine. And it's great to see how athletes have become role models in Jamaica and other Caribbean countries.
I'ts funny how none of this ,"so called"..."real sports fan enthusiasm", was around when R.Jacobs, M.Johnson, J.Gatlin, or G.Devers was setting records, but we are to just turn a blind eye when ALL runners for "southern" or Caribbean countries are setting PB's from 16-30ys old????
Maybe the U.S can get some of that "Water" from down there!
I guess the same could be said for the US women's sprint relay world record....
!!! We need that coach here for some of our athletes 
when this extreme improvement happened and was challenged we heard a lot from the US about talent and young guys can make enormous improvements with great coaching in order to rationalise the sudden improvement;;; other athletes from other countries can do the same.... well done, Weir.