TrackDaddy wrote:"Homegirl" "isnt going to be breaking 49" "speedy as she says she is"
Nice way to contort what I said... But let me state again what I said since you don't seem to get my point... Sanya Richards Ross is not going to break 49 if she continues to employ that tactic. Since she is such a speedster, she needs to get out fast and hard. She needs not to have the field with her with 100m to go like she had here, heck she should not be behind like she was here with 100m to go.
In her sub-49 races she went out harder than this. If she continues to run with this 'reserve to kick', running with her opponents, she is eventually going to meet up with someone (like Montsho, Ohoguru, Williams) who are VERY powerful in the closing sections of their race and will break her coming home. Novelene did that earlier in the season, Ohoguru did it in the Oly, Montsho did it to Felix, Williams did it to SRR in the Oly as well...
As I stated earlier-- I agree that Sanya should "kick" or make her move sooner than she did yesterday. I want her to be patient but she had my toes were curled in my shoes. When Montsho broke for the straight I was fit to be tied ...while Sanya patiently trailed.
I believe she used superior sprint speed-all other things being equal to catch Montsho and separate from them both. I'm not sure they were sprinting but I 'know' thats what Sanya was doing.
TrackDaddy wrote:If you were to ask TBO which race she wants Sanya to run I guarantee you it isnt the one you saw yesterday. Thats not the race that gave TBO the gold in Beijing.
I can guarantee that if you ask TBO 'what race she wants Sanya to run' she would look at you like you were totally crazy and reply 'What Sanya does is her concern i'll be running my own race'
TrackDaddy wrote:If you were to ask TBO which race she wants Sanya to run I guarantee you it isnt the one you saw yesterday. Thats not the race that gave TBO the gold in Beijing.
I can guarantee that if you ask TBO 'what race she wants Sanya to run' she would look at you like you were totally crazy and reply 'What Sanya does is her concern i'll be running my own race'
Actually TBO is quite concerned with what Sanya does.
See...
She's got to be at the right place and the right time and, in fact, cannot win unless Sanya makes a mistake. Otherwise her "own race" would be just that as she'd be out of the other one.
TrackDaddy wrote:If you were to ask TBO which race she wants Sanya to run I guarantee you it isnt the one you saw yesterday. Thats not the race that gave TBO the gold in Beijing.
I can guarantee that if you ask TBO 'what race she wants Sanya to run' she would look at you like you were totally crazy and reply 'What Sanya does is her concern i'll be running my own race'
Actually TBO is quite concerned with what Sanya does.
See...
She's got to be at the right place and the right time and, in fact, cannot win unless Sanya makes a mistake. Otherwise her "own race" would be just that as she'd be out of the other one.
If Christine was concerned about others she's bother to actually run the 1st 300m !! (she might even compete in the 4x4 as well)
TrackDaddy wrote:"Homegirl" "isnt going to be breaking 49" "speedy as she says she is"
Nice way to contort what I said... But let me state again what I said since you don't seem to get my point... Sanya Richards Ross is not going to break 49 if she continues to employ that tactic.
t_monk: if it were great conditions for the 400 rather than rather mediocre (look at the men's race run at close to the same time -- Merritt had run 44.19 and here ran 44.9...) she might have run 48 in this race. "...is not going to break 49" is really rather strong after a 49.39 in those conditions.
TrackDaddy wrote:"Homegirl" "isnt going to be breaking 49" "speedy as she says she is"
Nice way to contort what I said... But let me state again what I said since you don't seem to get my point... Sanya Richards Ross is not going to break 49 if she continues to employ that tactic.
t_monk: if it were great conditions for the 400 rather than rather mediocre (look at the men's race run at close to the same time -- Merritt had run 44.19 and here ran 44.9...) she might have run 48 in this race. "...is not going to break 49" is really rather strong after a 49.39 in those conditions.
Well the wind speed has been a bit swirling and unpredictable at the meet. Just look at the Long Jump which had high +ve winds and high -ve and still winds at times. Merrit ran 44.19 a while back, his latest performance was actually a 45.xx, plus I think he has been tinkering with his race pattern since that 44.19 run thus the time shown here.
It's 3 weeks until the trials so Natasha Hastings will be ready to make the Relay Pool.Yes a few collegiates will show up at the trials this year to make things difficult for the pros.
I guess this is as good a place as any to post this observation which will undoubtably please TD and piss off NSO. I've seen enough evidence to indicate to me that Sanya has sub-22 ability. I haven't seen anything that would indicate that Allyson has sub-49 ability. Allyson devoted a whole year to the 400 and yet could only lower her PR to 49.59. I'm sure both TD and NSO thought she would run faster than that. It seems to me that Allyson and Sanya are probably equal when it comes to raw speed talent (fast twitch muscle). However, I believe that Sanya has more God-given endurance talent (lactic acid tolerance).
jazzcyclist wrote:...It seems to me that Allyson and Sanya are probably equal when it comes to raw speed talent (fast twitch muscle). However, I believe that Sanya has more God-given endurance talent (lactic acid tolerance).
Interesting observations. Is the latter just that or is there info besides work product which perhaps demonstrates the result?
I would also say that Richards-Ross' acceleration dynamics and qualities appear more favorable, whereas Felix though perhaps slightly shorter, optimizes contact length more favorably.
jazzcyclist wrote:...It seems to me that Allyson and Sanya are probably equal when it comes to raw speed talent (fast twitch muscle). However, I believe that Sanya has more God-given endurance talent (lactic acid tolerance).
Interesting observations. Is the latter just that or is there info besides work product which perhaps demonstrates the result?
This observation is based strictly on her 400 resume, especially 2011.
TrackDaddy wrote:Actually I was surprised with the pr and credit Montsho for pulling her to it.
Her previous pr came while running neck and neck with Sanya, similar to the Daegu final.
So you didn't think she was capable of 49.59?
I just got to the point where I didn't expect it. People are still talking about a 4 yr old 2nd leg split in which you don't stay in your lane the whole lap but cut over. And in the yrs since, she hadnt improved her pr from 2007 or come within 1.7 of the split in the open event.
But if you think about it, she's still the 2nd fastest US 400m and among the best in the world.
TrackDaddy wrote:I just got to the point where I didn't expect it. People are still talking about a 4 yr old 2nd leg split in which you don't stay in your lane the whole lap but cut over. And in the yrs since, she hadnt improved her pr from 2007 or come within 1.7 of the split in the open event.
The fact that her PR was four years old didn't bother me since prior to 2011, she only dabbled in the 400, similar to Sanya's dabbling in the 200 and her outdated PR prior to a couple of weeks ago. However, last year Allyson did more than just dabble in the 400.
I think she did more than dabble in it. In 2010 AF was ranked #1 in the event and was the US champ. But never ran below 50. Not to mention, professionally it seems like she's run it a lot more than SRR has run the 200 especially when you consider the 4x4.
TrackDaddy wrote:I just got to the point where I didn't expect it. People are still talking about a 4 yr old 2nd leg split in which you don't stay in your lane the whole lap but cut over. And in the yrs since, she hadnt improved her pr from 2007 or come within 1.7 of the split in the open event.
The fact that her PR was four years old didn't bother me since prior to 2011, she only dabbled in the 400, similar to Sanya's dabbling in the 200 and her outdated PR prior to a couple of weeks ago. However, last year Allyson did more than just dabble in the 400.
She definitely was not dabbling in the 400 in 2010.
TrackDaddy wrote:I just got to the point where I didn't expect it. People are still talking about a 4 yr old 2nd leg split in which you don't stay in your lane the whole lap but cut over. And in the yrs since, she hadnt improved her pr from 2007 or come within 1.7 of the split in the open event.
The fact that her PR was four years old didn't bother me since prior to 2011, she only dabbled in the 400, similar to Sanya's dabbling in the 200 and her outdated PR prior to a couple of weeks ago. However, last year Allyson did more than just dabble in the 400.
She definitely was not dabbling in the 400 in 2010.
ATK wrote:The definition of dabbling I guess is not so clear.
Agreed that the definition is not clear, but in my opinion, she was dabbling. Everything about how she put that season together showed that it was an off-season/non-WC or Olympic year experimentation. Half the DL in the deuce and half in the 400m? Dabble. A full DL at 400m would have been a concentration, but no attempt to win a Diamond? Dabble.
ATK wrote:The definition of dabbling I guess is not so clear.
Agreed that the definition is not clear, but in my opinion, she was dabbling. Everything about how she put that season together showed that it was an off-season/non-WC or Olympic year experimentation. Half the DL in the deuce and half in the 400m? Dabble. A full DL at 400m would have been a concentration, but no attempt to win a Diamond? Dabble.
Exactly... She seemed more undecided than anything....
ATK wrote:The definition of dabbling I guess is not so clear.
Agreed that the definition is not clear, but in my opinion, she was dabbling. Everything about how she put that season together showed that it was an off-season/non-WC or Olympic year experimentation. Half the DL in the deuce and half in the 400m? Dabble. A full DL at 400m would have been a concentration, but no attempt to win a Diamond? Dabble.
Exactly... She seemed more undecided than anything....
I think the fact that it was an off season makes it seem that way. She had solid competitive 400's in the seasons prior to that. Those I would consider dabble seasons. She had her 200m focus, but would test the waters in the 400m. 2010, she technically had nothing to focus on, so she focused on both.
ATK wrote:The definition of dabbling I guess is not so clear.
Agreed that the definition is not clear, but in my opinion, she was dabbling. Everything about how she put that season together showed that it was an off-season/non-WC or Olympic year experimentation. Half the DL in the deuce and half in the 400m? Dabble. A full DL at 400m would have been a concentration, but no attempt to win a Diamond? Dabble.
You certainly wouldn't want to change events in a WC/Oly year without having some idea about your potential would you?
So she took a year to run it and was ranked #1.
Then the next year she ran it and got silver at the WC.
That's a dabble?
One dabbles in finger painting, not the 400 meters.
jazzcyclist wrote:I guess this is as good a place as any to post this observation which will undoubtably please TD and piss off NSO. I've seen enough evidence to indicate to me that Sanya has sub-22 ability. I haven't seen anything that would indicate that Allyson has sub-49 ability. Allyson devoted a whole year to the 400 and yet could only lower her PR to 49.59. I'm sure both TD and NSO thought she would run faster than that. It seems to me that Allyson and Sanya are probably equal when it comes to raw speed talent (fast twitch muscle). However, I believe that Sanya has more God-given endurance talent (lactic acid tolerance).
TrackDaddy wrote:Yes, jazz, I do find it pleasing.
It would be even more satisfying it others could acknowledge the same truth thats clearly before them.
NSO?
21.69 (2012) = 4th fastest time ever. (Actually it's the WR, but that's another story )
48.70 (2006) = 16th fastest time ever.
The difference between AF & SRR.
Last edited by NotSoOrdinary on Sun Jul 22, 2012 5:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
...while Sanya patiently trailed.
thats what Sanya was doing.
